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Message 1
From: Shawn + Elizabeth Newton
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:55:05 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36918] Re: Oil and Water
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the baren forum is not the only place on the internet
Google: gutenburg project
then a little search box comes up in the results and you can type in what you want to search in there...

later

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Message 2
From: "Nancy Osadchuk"
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:42:57 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36919] Re: Exchange 39 theme tallies and the 'technique' challenge
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I'm for the moku hanga, partly because that's about all I do for relief
printing. Also vote for Nature /technology. Will see what happens!

Nancy O

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Message 3
From: "Mike Lyon"
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:43:39 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36920] Re: Oil and Water
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OK... I tried it... Here's what I got:
Your search - moku-hanga site:gutenberg.org - did not match any documents.

Project Gutenberg is an on-line BOOK source...

A search for " japanese woodblock printmaking site:gutenberg.org" returns
ONE result: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/22263/22263-h/22263-h.htm

ENJOY!!! :o)

Anyway... Baren really is 'special' in that way, I think. VERY special!

Mike

Mike Lyon
Kansas City, MO
http://mlyon.com

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Message 4
From: ArtfulCarol # aol.com
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:50:33 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36921] Re: Exchange 39 theme tallies and the 'technique' challenge
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2 cents
Moku hanga versus woodblock prints however...
What about?:
39. Moku hanga
39a. Woodblock prints however

Carol Lyons
_http://rst-art.com/carolgallery.htm#WOODCUTS_
(http://rst-art.com/carolgallery.htm#WOODCUTS)

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Message 5
From: "viza arlington"
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:34:49 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36922] Daniel Smith
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tara,
i use Daniel Smith inks for relief printing and i like them over all. i have had some trouble with drying time (way over 7 days as stated in the blurb) so i would get the cobalt drier.
viza

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Message 6
From: "Maria Arango"
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:44:48 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36923] RE: Questions for Forum
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Hi Tara,
Congratulations on your new independent studio! Great thing about having your own is you can leave stuff half-done and nobody messes with it, well, except the cats (owner of 5 rescues here).

I'm one for using ink straight out of the can/tube/cartridge, but there are those times when you must use something to make the ink behave a particular way. Best source that I have found for learning all the additives and their uses is an old Graphic Chemical printed catalog, which I don't know if it is still being printed yearly.
The Daniel Smith yearly reference catalog is also a great source as are a number of printmaking books. Short (slightly outdated) list here:
http://1000woodcuts.com/studio/library.html
My particular favorite source for all printmaking is the Ross & Romano, "The Complete Printmaker", and our very own Ruth Leaf's, "Etching, Engraving and other Intaglio Printmaking Techniques".

Daniel Smith and Graphic Chemical inks are ready to go right out of the tube and I prefer to use them that way most of the time. Hanschy (sp?) inks were my absolute favorite, provided by Rembrandt Printmaking supplies, now I sadly hear they went out of business.

Etching inks can be used for relief printing as is or thickened a bit with either a thicker Plate Oil like #5 or #7 or whiting powder. I tend to use etching inks mixed in with transparent relief base only. The advantage of etching inks is the much wider variety of color choices. Viscosity is more forgiving for relief than for intaglio, that is, you don’t have to be as picky about viscosity when printing strictly relief. Well, I don’t.

Miracle Gel is essential if you print on unsized (waterleaf) paper of any kind as it prevents the paper from sticking to the block. I go very easy on this additive as it is greasy and tends to leave a halo and prevent drying of inks.

Driers, either Japan drier or Cobalt drier are not essential and you can save your cats accidents, especially with the Cobalt drier which is nasty stuff. A couple of drops for a glob of ink suffice incidentally, I would never add 5%! Having said that, when you are in a rush or want to print additional colors quickly, a couple of drops of Cobalt work miracles on drying time. Japan drier works a bit faster than air drying, but here in the desert, hardly can see the difference.
A completely non-toxic "drier" is to run your day old prints through the press with newsprint on top to remove excess ink. You can stack them and run them through several at a time, remove the newsprint and watch them dry completely in a short day.

Another additive that is useful is set-swell compound, which will reduce or eliminate the gloss on multiple applications of ink and keeps the lower layer of ink "open" to a new layer. Some people consider this essential for multi-color layered works.

To begin with, I would just get inks and transparent base and go at it. As you need additives you can, er, add them to your arsenal.

I hope all this helps, good luck in your new studio,
Maria

O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O
Maria Arango
http://1000woodcuts.com
http://artfestivalguide.info
O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O

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Message 7
From: "bobcatpath # 207me.com"
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 15:52:51 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36924] exchanges , white line woodcuts
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Bareners, I agree that our "issue" here need not be devisive
Nobody meant anything by proposing a MH exchange-its just an IDEA!!

That said , the implication that if someone does not want to try it,(hanga)
That they are somehow not adventurous or willing to learn new things is
silly
Perhaps they just know their own temperament pretty well

For myself , I know that I do not like "picky, picky , picky "
mediums-period
I choose oily for its ultra simplicity
As I also paint ,collage, sculpt write and photograph- I am pretty busy-
Not to mention hauling water and cutting wood and
generally messing around in the woods with my dog ;-)

Sharri- the provincetown printmakers used a water method developed by
B.J.O. Nordfeldt
Who had studied the Japanese method and wanted to simplify it to ONE block
only
but still get multiple colors
He simply carved a white line around all his figures and parts of the
design
Then he would brush on water colors and print the same block repeatedly
Over and over ,each time with different colors
Not really very different than Hanga ?

( question-would this method be ‘legal’ in a hanga exchange ?)

The innovation of white line woodcut occurred in Provincetown Mass (cape
cod)
in the teens and 20’s
And included artists such as Blanche Lazzell , Agnes Weinrich, Ada Gilmore
, Karl Knaths
and Ora Inge Maxim etc etc

It is the time consuming nature of White Line and Hanga
That is , of printing the same block over and over , and over
That gives it its LACK of appeal to me personally

I like the impulsive one- shot nature of black and white oily

But that is why I like to join exchanges
To FORCE myself to do color and to work SMALL
Which is harder for me who usually works BIG

Seems like there’s room for ALL of us yes ?
we just have to take turns , kids
And by the way - whats so shocking about being 70 ?
It just means you are ALIVE and kickin’ (or PRINTING ! )

Gillyin at 60 ! in Maine

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Message 8
From: Shawn + Elizabeth Newton
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:04:48 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36925] Re: Oil and Water
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then try something less specific. you've gotta work a search engine different ways to find what you want.
wood block site:gutenberg.org
when i search for something i try it different ways, i'll use more specific and sometimes more generic terms and the results are usually different but i can find something i want in each one.

don't stop after two searches. gutenberg has tons of stuff. i've found a few japanese wood print books in there, but since i wasn't really interested i never bothered to save the addresses.

later
:-)

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Message 9
From: Shawn + Elizabeth Newton
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:09:41 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36926] books
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here's another...
search: japanese wood block print making

http://www.gutenberg.org/files/20195/20195-h/20195-h.htm

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Message 10
From: "Maria Arango"
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:10:04 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36927] tallies
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Keep the votes coming.
I will be off to a Nature Printing Workshop this weekend where I'm sure
we'll have a healthy and heated debate on whether it is appropriate, moral,
and legal use "real" dead fish to print as it is traditionally done or print
from rubber models.

In any case, I will make a final decision when I get back--on the Exchange,
not on the fish.

Here are the tallies so far:

Exchange #39 Theme:
THEME VOTES
-Nature vs Technology 2
-Garden/Plant/Landscape 1
-Architecture 2
-A Personal View 4
-Self-portrait 5
-Trees 6
-Self-portrait as tree 8

Moku-hanga technique for Exchange #39 ONLY:
Yippee 13
Bummer 4
Let sleeping dogs lie 4

Oil only exchange 2
Double exchange: one moku-hanga and one open-technique 2

Structure Exchange schedule to introduce technique-challenge alternating
every four:
Yeah 2
No 2

-----
Impeach Maria:
Off with her head 1
Leave her alone, she'll settle down soon enough 1

Elect a Baren Survey & Tallying Committee:
1 (mine)
-----

Maria

 O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O
       Maria Arango
  http://1000woodcuts.com
http://artfestivalguide.info
 O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O=O

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Message 11
From: Linda Beeman
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:12:36 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36928] blog comments
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I have been asked why I didn't have "comments" activated on my blog.............well, because I didn't know they weren't! I think I have finally figured it out so if anyone wants to make nice, complimentary comments (My mom follows my blog so don't make her mad!) , feel free! ;0) I'd appreciate your honest feedback.

http://lindabeemanprintmaker.blogspot.com

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Message 12
From: Marilynn Smith
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:14:44 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36929] Re: New Baren Digest (HTML) V44 #4530 (Sep 16, 2008)
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If we rotate oily / watery /open / oily / water / open that means one
exchange annually will be oil based and one will be water based and
two will be open. I can agree with the idea of exchange 39 being an
all oily exchange. It does seem fair to those who do not work water
based and perhaps some of those all hanga folks will decide to try out
oil based pigments, who knows? I do not like the concept of saying
we need so many water based exchanges and so many oil based exchanges,
once in a while it seems fun. I like that the majority, more than 2 a
year are both, I like the diversity.

I understand and appreciate Maria's desire to kick us in the bottom
to get us to try new things and I think perhaps every few years a
change like this is fun, but I prefer less than once a year, just my
thoughts. I do not like that much "structure". Perhaps throwing a
twist in other ways might be fun, like an exchange that requires
embossing or one that requires a small portion be chine colle or one
using a metallic pigment or one that includes stencils. There are
more ways to change our exchanges than just to name so many water
based and so many oil based. Remember the fun we had adding poetry
with our exchange??? I think a black and white exchange would be
excellent, just like the 3 colors exchange was excellent. I vote to
leave things as they have been and encourage our coordinator to try
out other stimulating ideas. It is no less boring to add one more
structured thing, it just adds more rules and I do not like adding
more rules.

I do not do all the exchanges for various reasons, living 6 months one
place or another and at the moment being involved in a studio being
built. Some times I do not like a theme and if I am south getting
paper can be a problem and getting oil printing ink can be nearly
impossible. I have done both oil and water based prints. Often I
choose one over the other because the piece I am doing seems to be
best done with one media over another, I want to be the one who
chooses, not someone else, at least the majority of the time.

Happy printing,
Marilynn

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Message 13
From: Graham Scholes
Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2008 16:17:33 GMT
Subject: [Baren 36930] Re: books
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That was very interesting... Have browsed the pages.... and don’t you
like the link factor with page numbers.... I found some interesting,
ah be it, rather old fashion approach to the sport.

Thanks, Shawn.....

Graham

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End of [Baren] Digest