Today's postings
- [Baren 26234] RE: Mary Pratt prints and M C Escher ("Bill H. Ritchie, Jr.")
- [Baren 26235] Escheraria (ArtfulCarol # aol.com)
- [Baren 26236] Re: Mary Pratt Prints (Sharri LaPierre)
- [Baren 26237] Re: Mary Pratt prints (Bette Norcross Wappner)
- [Baren 26238] Re: shui-yin wrap-up (L Cass)
- [Baren 26239] Re: New Baren Digest (Text) V29 #2819 (Oct 12, 2004) ("Aimee Youmans")
- [Baren 26240] Dogma woodcuts ("Love Me")
- [Baren 26241] Dogma woodcuts ("Love Me")
- [Baren 26242] Dogma woodcuts ("Love Me")
- [Baren 26243] RE: Baren Digest (old) V29 #2820 ("marilynn smih")
- [Baren 26244] Re: Baren Digest (old) V29 #2820 (FurryPressII # aol.com)
Message 1
From: "Bill H. Ritchie, Jr."
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:03:22 -0700
Subject: [Baren 26234] RE: Mary Pratt prints and M C Escher
Send Message: To this poster
I like the range of opinions sparked by the Pratt prints. Here's mine, by
way of M. C. Escher:
"A printmaker has something of the minstrel spirit; he sings, and in every
print . . . he repeats his song over and over again . . .. The graphic
artist is like the blackbird singing at the top of the a tree. . . .He
wishes that the wind would scatter his leaves over the earth . . . not like
the dry leaves of autumn, but rather like seeds ready to germinate and light
as a feather." (from "The Escher Twist", a novel by Jane Langton.
Printmaking is, to me, close to music. We make a block (the instrument),
tune it, try it out, and perform with it, over and over again. It's a
self-rewarding, self-actualizing experience. I think many printmakers would
agree with me.
There are other people who make prints because they like the multiplier
effect, the economic rewards, the return-on-investment that reproductive
processes can, if done right, can yield. They like it, too, that they're
part of a system for sharing the profits, putting the bread on their
co-workers' tables.
There's a ready market for the familiar print, the signature, the effective
image, and many effective images today come by way of classic photography.
By classic photography, I mean one-point perspective, pre-cubist and
cinematic eras.
Printmakers have kept up with the changing times, particularly in things
like this barenforum. How different things were 40 years ago when we'd hang
on every bit of information about ways to etch a stone or do a photo
etching! Today printmakers are sharing their images, their secrets and their
souls with one another in a community fashion, worldwide.
Regarding Pratt's prints, I think it's telling, but not pejorative, to say,
"I don't even have to click on on the URL; I think I already know what the
print looks like. The important thing is that by yakking about it, we get
more ideas, we grow in ways we could not grow without the Net.
And printmaking - the kind Escher may have been writing about - brought us
here.
- Bill
way of M. C. Escher:
"A printmaker has something of the minstrel spirit; he sings, and in every
print . . . he repeats his song over and over again . . .. The graphic
artist is like the blackbird singing at the top of the a tree. . . .He
wishes that the wind would scatter his leaves over the earth . . . not like
the dry leaves of autumn, but rather like seeds ready to germinate and light
as a feather." (from "The Escher Twist", a novel by Jane Langton.
Printmaking is, to me, close to music. We make a block (the instrument),
tune it, try it out, and perform with it, over and over again. It's a
self-rewarding, self-actualizing experience. I think many printmakers would
agree with me.
There are other people who make prints because they like the multiplier
effect, the economic rewards, the return-on-investment that reproductive
processes can, if done right, can yield. They like it, too, that they're
part of a system for sharing the profits, putting the bread on their
co-workers' tables.
There's a ready market for the familiar print, the signature, the effective
image, and many effective images today come by way of classic photography.
By classic photography, I mean one-point perspective, pre-cubist and
cinematic eras.
Printmakers have kept up with the changing times, particularly in things
like this barenforum. How different things were 40 years ago when we'd hang
on every bit of information about ways to etch a stone or do a photo
etching! Today printmakers are sharing their images, their secrets and their
souls with one another in a community fashion, worldwide.
Regarding Pratt's prints, I think it's telling, but not pejorative, to say,
"I don't even have to click on on the URL; I think I already know what the
print looks like. The important thing is that by yakking about it, we get
more ideas, we grow in ways we could not grow without the Net.
And printmaking - the kind Escher may have been writing about - brought us
here.
- Bill
Message 2
From: ArtfulCarol # aol.com
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 17:22:39 EDT
Subject: [Baren 26235] Escheraria
Send Message: To this poster
Speaking of Escher, I have added some variants, A-D, to my Escheraria set of
prints.
They are based on a technique used by Escher.
The name was coined by my Webmaster.
http://rst-art.com/carolgallery.htm#Escheraria Woodcuts
Carol Lyons
Irvington, NY
PS There is no venom here in Baren, just people sharing their
information,preferences, opinions....This is THE greatest source for woodblock prints.
And when we disagree, we agree to disagree.
prints.
They are based on a technique used by Escher.
The name was coined by my Webmaster.
http://rst-art.com/carolgallery.htm#Escheraria Woodcuts
Carol Lyons
Irvington, NY
PS There is no venom here in Baren, just people sharing their
information,preferences, opinions....This is THE greatest source for woodblock prints.
And when we disagree, we agree to disagree.
Message 3
From: Sharri LaPierre
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:37:34 -0700
Subject: [Baren 26236] Re: Mary Pratt Prints
Send Message: To this poster
Aha! Finally something I can jump into with both feet. Helen
Frankenthaler's large woodblocks were painted onto wood the same size
as the finished print. The paintings were done as the "sketch" for the
woodblock prints, not intended to be paintings unto themselves. The
grain of the wood was part of the painting and was carefully reproduced
on the blocks for the print. Then Helen worked with master printer(s)
to resolve the finished prints. She very definitely had her hand in
the printmaking, but did not do it entirely by herself. Can you
imagine trying to lay a 5' square sheet of paper onto the block by
yourself? LOL Or, if you've ever tried to reproduce woodgrain,
especially on such large prints, well - who could blame a gal for
enlisting some help?
Cheers,
Sharri
Frankenthaler's large woodblocks were painted onto wood the same size
as the finished print. The paintings were done as the "sketch" for the
woodblock prints, not intended to be paintings unto themselves. The
grain of the wood was part of the painting and was carefully reproduced
on the blocks for the print. Then Helen worked with master printer(s)
to resolve the finished prints. She very definitely had her hand in
the printmaking, but did not do it entirely by herself. Can you
imagine trying to lay a 5' square sheet of paper onto the block by
yourself? LOL Or, if you've ever tried to reproduce woodgrain,
especially on such large prints, well - who could blame a gal for
enlisting some help?
Cheers,
Sharri
Message 4
From: Bette Norcross Wappner
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 17:37:32 -0400
Subject: [Baren 26237] Re: Mary Pratt prints
Send Message: To this poster
here's an interesting biography of Mary Pratt that also explains her
passion of emotive realism.
http://www.collectionscanada.ca/women/h12-519-e.html
I'm enjoying everyone's opinions :)
we're all driven by the 'muse' down different paths, yet parallel to
each other. we are reacting naturally to the power that a unique
collaboration such as this holds in the depths of its creation and the
beauty of it is not in the style we perceive it, but in learning about
the magicical force behind it and how it affects us all.
thank you Bill Richie for posting Escher's quote about printmaking!
wonderful :)
i also 'loved' our Ray Hudson's poem at the Baren archives in the
article about Chinese Watercolor Printing with Bea Gold:
http://www.barenforum.org/newsletter/issue04/issue04.html#feature1
Ray, you say it well about printmaking a, b, c - what a beautiful
beautiful poem. I'm framing it for my studio!
bette wappner
northern kentucky
(took a short break and now getting back to work)
passion of emotive realism.
http://www.collectionscanada.ca/women/h12-519-e.html
I'm enjoying everyone's opinions :)
we're all driven by the 'muse' down different paths, yet parallel to
each other. we are reacting naturally to the power that a unique
collaboration such as this holds in the depths of its creation and the
beauty of it is not in the style we perceive it, but in learning about
the magicical force behind it and how it affects us all.
thank you Bill Richie for posting Escher's quote about printmaking!
wonderful :)
i also 'loved' our Ray Hudson's poem at the Baren archives in the
article about Chinese Watercolor Printing with Bea Gold:
http://www.barenforum.org/newsletter/issue04/issue04.html#feature1
Ray, you say it well about printmaking a, b, c - what a beautiful
beautiful poem. I'm framing it for my studio!
bette wappner
northern kentucky
(took a short break and now getting back to work)
Message 5
From: L Cass
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 13:09:03 -0400
Subject: [Baren 26238] Re: shui-yin wrap-up
Send Message: To this poster
More apologies for another posting - this should have been a P.S. to
previous where
I forgot to add my thanks to Ray and Bea for directing us to the info on
shui-yin
Now I must get on with attempting to paint glaciers after becoming
entranced with them on a recent (first ever) trip to Alaska
The extraordinary Totem poles up there should also furnish inspiration for
a series of woodcuts - I hope.
L.C.
previous where
I forgot to add my thanks to Ray and Bea for directing us to the info on
shui-yin
Now I must get on with attempting to paint glaciers after becoming
entranced with them on a recent (first ever) trip to Alaska
The extraordinary Totem poles up there should also furnish inspiration for
a series of woodcuts - I hope.
L.C.
Message 6
From: "Aimee Youmans"
Date: Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:36:47 -0800
Subject: [Baren 26239] Re: New Baren Digest (Text) V29 #2819 (Oct 12, 2004)
Send Message: To this poster
....that would be "....still waiting for a bunch of monkeys to swing in."
seems my message got cut off--the rest might well have been, because my
computer seems to be en retarde. My message was written before the baren
conversation answered my question to Ray. In any case, I love the look of
the shui-yin, and thanks everyone for passing on any close encounters with
it...
Thank you, Barbara, for your discourse on ink--my first and only experience
with waterbase is with daniel smith, and i didn't know that one could expect
more... Aimee
seems my message got cut off--the rest might well have been, because my
computer seems to be en retarde. My message was written before the baren
conversation answered my question to Ray. In any case, I love the look of
the shui-yin, and thanks everyone for passing on any close encounters with
it...
Thank you, Barbara, for your discourse on ink--my first and only experience
with waterbase is with daniel smith, and i didn't know that one could expect
more... Aimee
Message 7
From: "Love Me"
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2004 12:02:41 +1000
Subject: [Baren 26240] Dogma woodcuts
Send Message: To this poster
On 'photo-realism' and woodcuts. Having all viewed the browser version of the digital images of the woodblock prints of the carvings of the (probable scans) of the watercolour of the (probable) photograph of the fruit, it is hard to know where to point the finger. Maybe the camera is at fault, maybe not. But, after 500 years (given da Vinci used Camera Obscura in 1490) the camera is still treated like the poor cousin in the artistic process.
Photography changed the way woodblock prints were made. The consumer base for prints collapsed with the arrival of photographs, so the camera could hardly be ignored. Prints from the Meiji era were often made from a photographic template, imperial events and buildings are depicted with detail and perspective that can only be seen through a camera lens. In the Shin-hanga movement there are many prints that have the feel of photography. Even if Hasui never touched a camera his work is often photo-realistic. Whatever the style, print images after the camera are made in the knowledge that photo-realism is easily achieved by anyone with a camera, with or without artistic sensibility.
If Barbara would like "woodblocks to look like woodblocks", and not like photographs, maybe we need a new school of 'Dogma' woodblock printing:
All work must be carved directly into the block. All work must be conceived from the imagination or observed directly from life. No peeking at photographs (including reproductions of other artwork)
Similar rulings may be considered to ban the pencil, and the brush. Afterall, why make woodcuts that look like drawings, or paintings?
Me, I prefer to work from a good photograph than labour over a bad drawing.
Tom
Photography changed the way woodblock prints were made. The consumer base for prints collapsed with the arrival of photographs, so the camera could hardly be ignored. Prints from the Meiji era were often made from a photographic template, imperial events and buildings are depicted with detail and perspective that can only be seen through a camera lens. In the Shin-hanga movement there are many prints that have the feel of photography. Even if Hasui never touched a camera his work is often photo-realistic. Whatever the style, print images after the camera are made in the knowledge that photo-realism is easily achieved by anyone with a camera, with or without artistic sensibility.
If Barbara would like "woodblocks to look like woodblocks", and not like photographs, maybe we need a new school of 'Dogma' woodblock printing:
All work must be carved directly into the block. All work must be conceived from the imagination or observed directly from life. No peeking at photographs (including reproductions of other artwork)
Similar rulings may be considered to ban the pencil, and the brush. Afterall, why make woodcuts that look like drawings, or paintings?
Me, I prefer to work from a good photograph than labour over a bad drawing.
Tom
Message 8
From: "Love Me"
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2004 12:02:55 +1000
Subject: [Baren 26241] Dogma woodcuts
Send Message: To this poster
Repeat of Message 7
Message 9
From: "Love Me"
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2004 12:03:08 +1000
Subject: [Baren 26242] Dogma woodcuts
Send Message: To this poster
Repeat of Message 7
Message 10
From: "marilynn smih"
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2004 00:09:46 -0700
Subject: [Baren 26243] RE: Baren Digest (old) V29 #2820
Send Message: To this poster
Okay this is a technical question. I am having trouble transfering my image
on to my plate. I got my zerox copies, took out that horrid toxic lacquer
thinner to transfer my image. Only parts of the image transfered??? I
rubbed it well and I added more toxic stuff and it just would not
transfer??? I am using basswood. So I got one image to transfer and the
rest just sort of did. Is it a new zerox machine, me or what???
I am doing an image i did in watercolor, that I sold to an art teacher in
New York. Does that mean I am just copying and this is not original? Since
there seems to be some sort of thing about if it was a painting or a drawing
design we are using?? As far as technical process is concerned I admire all
good compositons and good color. There are many wonderful people on this
list each with wonderful styles, I admire each of you for you individuality
and different approaches to art, especially printmaking.
I applaud your freedom and your caring attitude. I benefit from your
sharing. I enjoy seeing your work and the work of others that you share
with us. I thank each of you for your time, your sharing in exchanges and
just for being here. I am grateful that we have different opinions and are
strong enough to be each ourselves. I say follow your own star and create
what you do best.
One other question Bette what is happening with exchange is it 22? I leave
in about a month and need to let my mail ladies know if they will have a
package for me while I am gone?? Thank you for you time and I hope it is a
full and beautiful group of work, as usual.
Marilynn
on to my plate. I got my zerox copies, took out that horrid toxic lacquer
thinner to transfer my image. Only parts of the image transfered??? I
rubbed it well and I added more toxic stuff and it just would not
transfer??? I am using basswood. So I got one image to transfer and the
rest just sort of did. Is it a new zerox machine, me or what???
I am doing an image i did in watercolor, that I sold to an art teacher in
New York. Does that mean I am just copying and this is not original? Since
there seems to be some sort of thing about if it was a painting or a drawing
design we are using?? As far as technical process is concerned I admire all
good compositons and good color. There are many wonderful people on this
list each with wonderful styles, I admire each of you for you individuality
and different approaches to art, especially printmaking.
I applaud your freedom and your caring attitude. I benefit from your
sharing. I enjoy seeing your work and the work of others that you share
with us. I thank each of you for your time, your sharing in exchanges and
just for being here. I am grateful that we have different opinions and are
strong enough to be each ourselves. I say follow your own star and create
what you do best.
One other question Bette what is happening with exchange is it 22? I leave
in about a month and need to let my mail ladies know if they will have a
package for me while I am gone?? Thank you for you time and I hope it is a
full and beautiful group of work, as usual.
Marilynn
Message 11
From: FurryPressII # aol.com
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2004 08:03:43 EDT
Subject: [Baren 26244] Re: Baren Digest (old) V29 #2820
Send Message: To this poster
A couple of things to think about with zerox transfer
1. if you are getting a weak transfered image
a. increase the amount of toner
b. do it outside but paint the block with the thinner and then put it
on the back as well
c. you can get a spotie image if you wait too long before rubbing.
d. sometimes the copyier effects how it turns out older machines
tend to work better as they leave out more toner
2. always do it outside with plenty of ventilation and use rubber gloves.
other ways of transfer paper litho and heat transfer
john c.
1. if you are getting a weak transfered image
a. increase the amount of toner
b. do it outside but paint the block with the thinner and then put it
on the back as well
c. you can get a spotie image if you wait too long before rubbing.
d. sometimes the copyier effects how it turns out older machines
tend to work better as they leave out more toner
2. always do it outside with plenty of ventilation and use rubber gloves.
other ways of transfer paper litho and heat transfer
john c.