Baren Digest              Tuesday, 28 August 2001      Volume 16 : Number 1537


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From: John and Jan Telfer <jtelfer@iinet.net.au>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 01 22:21:54 -0000
Subject: [Baren 15538] Re: Simple Printmaking 

Wanda wrote:
>I had a chance to look at the "Simple Printmaking" book that April is talking
>about & really enjoyed seeing my baren friends' prints in it. One of my 
>friends
>bought it just for the artist's prints that were in it - as she is already an
>accomplished printmaker!

Yes, me too.  We have it here in Fremantle's Art Centre Book Shop (south 
of Perth in Western Australia...yes, even down here)  and I too enjoyed 
seeing my Baren Friends in there, but I was a bit sad as mine were 
rejected....  I don't think a slide really gives the full extent or 
concept of the work of art.  The slides I sent were of art pieces 45cm x 
30cm! I consoled myself that maybe mine were Too Good to be 
included!!!!!!!!!

Just kidding myself, but next time maybe!
Jan

------------------------------

From: "April Vollmer" <april@aprilvollmer.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 11:39:34 -0400
Subject: [Baren 15539] Keeping Positive

Michael, very interesting to hear about the Austrian copyright system.
Sounds like it makes the rich richer, though! I wonder if it also has the
effect of having publishers use (free) non-member photographs more often?

And Phil, yes, of course you are right, artists should get paid too! We
should all work to get more recognition as professionals, to be paid for
exhibiting, etc, as in Canada. But mostly we don't get paid, so I try to
connect with respectable opportunities from folks who are also in in because
they love art. I sincerely doubt whether the author or publisher in this
case made much money at all. The artists I know who have written books
assure me that it is not more lucrative than selling art!

There is a peculiar feeling, perhaps especially in the U.S.?, that artists
are 'getting away' with something. They are having fun, doing what they
want, and so don't deserve support, no matter how hard they work. It is
helpful to recognize this, but not healthy to think about it too much! As we
say around Baren, just keep smiling: cut! print!

April
www.aprilvollmer.com


------------------------------

From: Mike Lyon <mikelyon@mlyon.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 10:40:55 -0500
Subject: [Baren 15540] Photo-Relief Printing? 

Hey, Bareners!  I have a question for you!  I've found myself including 
some kind of text in my prints more often in recent years -- I used to 
carve the text -- but I'm becoming more verbose in my old age and tiny type 
sizes and sheer quantity of text is beyond my time and patience to carve -- 
I've found other ways to include text -- photo-intaglio process using 
Image-on is easy and works well, but it's not relief printing -- 
photo-silkscreen is also easy for me -- I picked up a Douthitt 42"x52" 
screen burner for $300 a few years ago -- it's a UV light source and vacuum 
frame in one big enclosed box and works GREAT!  By the way, they are still 
manufactured and cost around $8,800 new, so I feel pretty happy every time 
I use the thing.

Anyway, my question is:  Is there a photo-process relief printing material 
or method out there?  Something I could use to easily produce type and 
other elements for relief printing?  Look forward to hearing from you, and 
hope you have some good ideas for me!

Mike
Mike Lyon
mailto:mikelyon@mlyon.com
http://www.mlyon.com 

------------------------------

From: "Maria Arango" <maria@mariarango.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 08:50:07 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15541] they told me... 

They told me not to send 3 slides to a publisher, not to give my art away -
today I'm in a book. I give the book away too, to people that want to be
printmakers just like us.

They told me not to have a website because it cheapens a true artist -
today I have children (and adults) writing me daily to thank me for the
information and for sharing my art. Five contracts have come my way out of
the blue because someone found me on the web.

They told me not to become a peddling artist because you can't sell real art
that way -
today I'm traveling and sharing with incredibly appreciative and supportive
audiences. Six galleries to date have purchased my prints and two have
already asked for more. This year to date I have prostituted over 400 prints
in exchange for that disgusting, cheapening, did I mention disgusting? stuff
we call money.

They told me not to do figurative work because figures aren't
"contemporary"; they told me not to date my work, or to date it, to collage
my images in today's style and avoid the narrative approach, to keep my
editions low or to make them larger, to mat with white mats only, to use
more color, to do woodcuts only in black and white, to frame only in wood,
not to sell the precious original blocks, to have someone else talk about my
art, to join printmaking societies, not to do boring landscapes either...

They told me (right here in Baren, folks!) to exchange prints with other
artists only until I started selling mine because then I would be giving
money away --
today I have a collection of over 450 delicious treasures from enthusiastic
fellow printmakers, unknown to the world just like me.

They told me to get a body of cohesive work together and make a statement
about it, to manufacture prints in exactly the same style, paper, and size -
Instead I started making 1,000 prints...and thus became a printmaker.

They told me I couldn't be an artist...
- --please please please keep telling me not to do things.

Health to all,
Maria

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Maria Arango
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
http://www.1000woodcuts.com
maria@mariarango.com
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><>


------------------------------

From: "bemason" <bemason@concentric.net>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 08:52:18 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15542] Re: Photo-Relief Printing? 

Mike,
couldn't you make a metal plate with the writing raised and roll the ink on
and print in conjunction with your other relief work? I think this would
work, If you have trouble getting the ink to only be on the letters, roll on
some transparent base over the plate in a different viscosity so the ink
will not want to stick on the back ground, I have found this to work
sometimes. I think we would be ok with this, after all it is still relief.
sort of on the edge of it, but still relief. We would love to see your
letterwork in an exchange.
Barbara

> Anyway, my question is:  Is there a photo-process relief printing material
> or method out there?  Something I could use to easily produce type and
> other elements for relief printing?  Look forward to hearing from you, and
> hope you have some good ideas for me!
>
> Mike
> Mike Lyon
> mailto:mikelyon@mlyon.com
> http://www.mlyon.com
>



------------------------------

From: "Bill H Ritchie Jr" <ritchie@seanet.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 09:34:10 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15543] Re: Smarter not Harder 

I can think of no more appropriate place to have a forum on "work smarter
not harder" and "free art" etc.

In my view, we're entering a new era, when we are seeing the old world dying
(second and third hand printed art pictures in magazines) and a new world
being born.

If you think having your art printed free in a nice color publication
(regardless of the distortions of size and texture, but most of all the aura
of the real thing), then you'll love seeing the new forms "in the pipeline."

I am referring to new systems for disseminating the image of the art (which
we already have in the form of .JPG and .GIF, plus .PDF, etc.) downloads
PLUS information in depth about the artist.

Let the visual artist write poems, too. They'll be in there. Let the
artist/poet write and perform music. That'll be in there. Let the artist
share their dreams, aspirations for a better safer world for the
grandchildren. Those'll be in there, too. Let the artist get money in the
night, just for having someone "click" on their name. That'll be in there.

And let the artist's rights be protected by new encryption systems that are
more certain to protect the integrity of the artists, their families and
their communities than any printed publication could ever promise.

Most of the generation of people I was born with (1941) love our paper
publications, with a passion. The generation born in 2000 will wonder why,
when they look around. "How quaint," they'll say. That's what I think.

And we will, many of us, still be around to see it! We have, on average,
another 30 years left to make prints.

And Peace.

- - Bill

Bill H. Ritchie, Jr
500 Aloha #105
Seattle WA 98109
(206) 285-0658
Professional: www.seanet.com/~ritchie
E-Store: www.myartpatron.com
General: www.emeraldaworks.com
First Game Portal: www.artsport.com


------------------------------

From: "Gregory Robison" <robison@dial.pipex.com>
Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2001 17:35:46 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15544] Re: Photo-Relief Printing? 
Mike:

There's a process using photopolymer coated plates which you expose using
ultraviolet light (so you can just stick 'em outside in the sun if there is
no fine type) and 'develop' using water, so no toxic chemicals.  You use a
right-reading, high contrast negative in contact with the plate during
exposure.  The result is a plate with a raised printing surface, resembling
a zinc, copper or magnesium plate such as the letterpress people often use
(but these metal plates have to be done by an engraving company, whereas you
can make your own photopolymer plates yourself).  I've experimented a little
with this but never did anything included in a final piece.  There's a guy
in NY who deals in this and can send you a lot of information (including
plans on how to make your own UV exposure unit...which I did.  Pretty
simple).  His name is Gene Becker (genebecker@worldnet.att.net) or telephone
718-454-0654.  Good luck.

Gregory Robison
Edinburgh, Scotland


- -----Original Message-----
From: Mike Lyon <mikelyon@mlyon.com>
To: baren@ml.asahi-net.or.jp <baren@ml.asahi-net.or.jp>
Date: Monday, August 27, 2001 8:42 AM
Subject: [Baren 15540] Photo-Relief Printing?


>Hey, Bareners!  I have a question for you!  I've found myself including
>some kind of text in my prints more often in recent years -- I used to
>carve the text -- but I'm becoming more verbose in my old age and tiny type
>sizes and sheer quantity of text is beyond my time and patience to carve --
>I've found other ways to include text -- photo-intaglio process using
>Image-on is easy and works well, but it's not relief printing --
>photo-silkscreen is also easy for me -- I picked up a Douthitt 42"x52"
>screen burner for $300 a few years ago -- it's a UV light source and vacuum
>frame in one big enclosed box and works GREAT!  By the way, they are still
>manufactured and cost around $8,800 new, so I feel pretty happy every time
>I use the thing.
>
>Anyway, my question is:  Is there a photo-process relief printing material
>or method out there?  Something I could use to easily produce type and
>other elements for relief printing?  Look forward to hearing from you, and
>hope you have some good ideas for me!
>
>Mike
>Mike Lyon
>mailto:mikelyon@mlyon.com
>http://www.mlyon.com


------------------------------

From: "Philip Smith" <SmithArt@Pacifier.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 10:26:09 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15545] Pay-o-la 

You know Maria, all I'm trying to do is to keep the printmaker from getting,
and forgive the phrase April, duped!
I know it's very cavalier to say  you give books away to friends and you
been swimming upstream against the hordes of "theys", but all I wanted to do
is say that this world of art is a business.
Sure I do commercial illustration, so shoot me. But I don't give it away.
Not to say that I haven't been suckered a few times. And you know it hurts
me when I have good intensions and someone takes me to the cleaners. It's my
time, my materials, my life that's getting usurped. And if you think these
little books don't costs a lot of money to produce, you're wrong!
Guys, I don't want to pound you into the ground on this, and I'm sorry that
those of you who wanted to get into this little publication didn't.
Remember, there's books being published every minute of everyday. If you
want to be published, send samples to that publisher. And you know what?
They WILL pay you for your work.
Philip
Hammond, OR
USA


------------------------------

From: Daniel Dew <ddew@tampabay.rr.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 14:27:59 -0400
Subject: [Baren 15546] Shakespearian 

Oh Julio, Oh Julio, where fore art thou oh Julio?
We have not heard from yonder star shining bright for many moons.
Our hearts ache for your gentle wisdom.
Oh Julio, Oh Julio, where fore art thou oh Julio?

dan dew 

------------------------------

From: "Robert" <rcg@robertcanagagallery.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 11:34:41 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15547] Re:Using Oils on paper charset="iso-8859-1" 

Gayle, A lot of the older(300yo) paintings were done with walnut oil. If you
go and look close at the whites and lighter blues in paintings 100+ years
old, when linseed oils were in common use,you see a greening in the blue and
a yellowing in the whites.
It is subtle in most cases but when it's bad, it is really bad The
industrial grade of linseed oil you buy in art stores(the cheep stuff) will
yellow very rapidly.
If you are isolating your paper or canvas, acids don't matter, painting on
raw paper or canvas is a problem.
- ----- Original Message -----
From: "GWohlken" <blueman@pantek.com>
To: <baren@ml.asahi-net.or.jp>
Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2001 6:58 AM
Subject: [Baren 15527] Re:Using Oils on paper

> > The acidification of linseed oil is rapid and very yellowing, and after
a
> > long time the acid will actually eat through the paper.
>
> Are we to understand, Robert, that the oil based inks we use (not just
> oil paint) will also do the same to paper?  The reason I ask is why do
> the old prints in collections in art museums look fine?
>
> Gayle
> Ohio, USA
>


------------------------------

From: michael schneider <mikasch@t0.or.at>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 22:38:42 +0200
Subject: [Baren 15548] Re: Photo-Relief Printing? 

Yes there is a easy way! You tried the imagon so it should be no problem
for you to use the photo polymere called SOLAR PLATE there is a good
book by Dan Weldon. He describes the process and material. I use plates
called nyloprint manufactured by BASF but there are other maker around
the globe. The process is very simmilar to imagon but the nyloprint
plates are much thicker. Therefor you get a much stronger reliefe. When
the plate is not completely hardened it is possible to use it even for
water based printmaking. But beware there are types that dissolve in
water.

michael 

Vienna, Austria

Mike Lyon wrote:
> 
> Hey, Bareners!  I have a question for you!  I've found myself including
> some kind of text in my prints more often in recent years -- I used to
> carve the text -- but I'm becoming more verbose in my old age and tiny type
> sizes and sheer quantity of text is beyond my time and patience to carve --
> I've found other ways to include text -- photo-intaglio process using
> Image-on is easy and works well, but it's not relief printing --
> photo-silkscreen is also easy for me -- I picked up a Douthitt 42"x52"
> screen burner for $300 a few years ago -- it's a UV light source and vacuum
> frame in one big enclosed box and works GREAT!  By the way, they are still
> manufactured and cost around $8,800 new, so I feel pretty happy every time
> I use the thing.
> 
> Anyway, my question is:  Is there a photo-process relief printing material
> or method out there?  Something I could use to easily produce type and
> other elements for relief printing?  Look forward to hearing from you, and
> hope you have some good ideas for me!
> 
> Mike
> Mike Lyon
> mailto:mikelyon@mlyon.com
> http://www.mlyon.com

------------------------------

From: michael schneider <mikasch@t0.or.at>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 22:50:10 +0200
Subject: [Baren 15549] Re: Keeping Positive 

April Vollmer wrote:
> 
> Michael, very interesting to hear about the Austrian copyright system.
> Sounds like it makes the rich richer, though! I wonder if it also has the
> effect of having publishers use (free) non-member photographs more often?

That is exactly what happens!
And the non member does have a better stand when talking to a publisher.
They do not have to pay the VBK but they know that the copyright should
be rewarded. What they pay might be less than what they would pay to the
VBK but the artist does not need to share.
After all I am happy to see my work published. There is nothing better
that can happen than a art interested person entering your show to tell
you, "I saw this work in XXXXX and I liked it. So these are the
originals." You cant have a better start.

michael 

Vienna Austria

------------------------------

From: FurryPressII@aol.com
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 20:47:16 EDT
Subject: [Baren 15550] Re: Photo-Relief Printing? 

if you don't have the patiance to cut text (i like the chalange have even cut 
8pt type) and want to keep it in the relief or letterpress tradition you 
could use lead type or set in on computer and have mag. photo blocks made 
from the computer printout.

i prefer hand cut wood type than lead type  most  but can understand the use 
of the photo plates.  

john of the furry press

------------------------------

From: "bemason" <bemason@concentric.net>
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 18:19:41 -0700
Subject: [Baren 15551] promo 

Here is a little promo for a non-profit art institute whose board I am on.
so read if you are interested, or not as you choose!
Best to all,
Barbara
http://www.crowsshadow.org/conduit4.html

------------------------------

From: Legreenart@cs.com
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2001 22:14:37 EDT
Subject: [Baren 15552] Re: Baren Digest V16 #1535 


I am hoping to come to the Portland symposium...May not have the money. 
Anyone willing to let me sleep on their floor?

Yours, 
Le Green
Stonemetal Press
Email: legreenart@cs.com
http://www.stonemetal-press.com


------------------------------

From: Ray Hudson <rhudson@together.net>
Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 06:49:56 -0400
Subject: [Baren 15553] snow prints 

Do any of you have any favorite snow techniques using waterbased
materials?  (With oil I think you can put white snow on top of other
colors, but with waterbased inks it's a bit more tricky.)  Carving
endless little dots of various sizes creates horrible printing problems
at times, but seems to be the most common method.  But how about getting
snow of slightly different colors--the farther away the grayer it seems
to be.
Ray (in Vermont but NOT expecting any snow yet)

------------------------------

From: FurryPressII@aol.com
Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2001 08:26:44 EDT
Subject: [Baren 15554] Re: snow prints 

furry thinking snow already.

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End of Baren Digest V16 #1537
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