Baren Digest                Friday, 1 March 2002        Volume 18 : Number 1744


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: G Wohlken <blueman@pantek.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:50:16 -0500
Subject: [Baren 17260] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743 

Thank you, everyone, for your suggestions for flattening the paper again 
after the cat-jump mishap.  Only one of them now looks a little 
"different".  It's flat but the edges (margin) seem wavy on that one,  
which means something stretched, I'm thinking, after I moistened it. 
 Since it was printed with oil based inks, I wonder if the inked area 
stayed intact, and the outer edge stetched.  I may have sprayed it 
unevenly, too.  I also did try a little steam ironing, but put newprint 
over the print itself
to protect it from the iron.

Maria, regarding your small baren.  I have a real baren, too, that I 
bought from Matsumura-san, but think using it on oil based inked prints 
might be hard on it.  Does anyone know?  I imagine the covering will 
wear out pretty quickly?  I have been tempted to use it on my oil-based 
prints, but feel it was made for hanga, specifically.  I hope you give 
us reports from time to time about the wear and tear on it.

Gayle Wohlken
Ohio, USA  

 




------------------------------

From: Mike Lyon <mikelyon@mlyon.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:13:19 -0600
Subject: [Baren 17261] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743 

Steam iron, distilled water?

Mike

At 10:01 PM 2/28/2002 +0900, you wrote:

>The paper is kitakata
>which is  very thin paper.  If you mention moistening and putting under
>pressure, I need to know
>how much pressure and for how long?  If that's not the way to do it,
>then does anyone
>have a suggestion?
>
>Gayle
>
>
>


Mike Lyon
mailto:mikelyon@mlyon.com
http://www.mlyon.com 

------------------------------

From: "Lee and Barbara Mason" <bemason@concentric.net>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 06:58:36 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17262] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743 

Gayle,
I use mine back and forth all the time with no problems, as long as you do
not have it in the ink, I see no difference. If you are worried just be sure
to use a slip sheet. I don't think oil based ink will wear it out faster. I
usually use setswell and transparent base in litho ink, and cannot tell much
difference when printing, except that I need to use a little more elbow
grease, and for hand printing with oil, kitikata is my favorite paper.
Barbara


> Maria, regarding your small baren.  I have a real baren, too, that I
> bought from Matsumura-san, but think using it on oil based inked prints
> might be hard on it.  Does anyone know?  I imagine the covering will
> wear out pretty quickly?  I have been tempted to use it on my oil-based
> prints, but feel it was made for hanga, specifically.  I hope you give
> us reports from time to time about the wear and tear on it.
>
> Gayle Wohlken
> Ohio, USA




------------------------------

From: Graham <gscholes@woodblock.info>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 07:52:19 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17263] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743 


Have you any of that glassine type paper to use as a slip sheet. 
Barbara " a bunch to Boot Camp on year. Was it the year you were 
there?  Memory memory, where are you..... At any rate Barbara, can 
you elaborate....

Wavy paper.... I could be the oil base ink that is set in its 
ways.....  like a senior ink....  is not flexible to the process.... 
(*<:

Graham



>Gayle,
>I use mine back and forth all the time with no problems, as long as you do
>not have it in the ink, I see no difference. If you are worried just be sure
>to use a slip sheet. I don't think oil based ink will wear it out faster. I
>usually use setswell and transparent base in litho ink, and cannot tell much
>difference when printing, except that I need to use a little more elbow
>grease, and for hand printing with oil, kitikata is my favorite paper.
>Barbara
>

>> Maria, regarding your small baren.  I have a real baren, too, that I
>> bought from Matsumura-san, but think using it on oil based inked prints
>> might be hard on it.  Does anyone know?  I imagine the covering will
>> wear out pretty quickly?  I have been tempted to use it on my oil-based
>> prints, but feel it was made for hanga, specifically.  I hope you give
>> us reports from time to time about the wear and tear on it.
>>
>> Gayle Wohlken
>> Ohio, USA



------------------------------

From: "Lee and Barbara Mason" <bemason@concentric.net>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 07:52:24 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17264] waxy paper 

Re: [Baren 17262] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743
  The waxy paper I took to boot camp was cooking parchment. I bought a 
box of it  (20x26") in a cash and carry wholesale grocery for about $35 
and have been using it for everything from tracing paper to slip sheets 
for years. It just never seems to use itself up....maybe it is 
multiplying in the drawer...one never knows what goes on in the studio 
when we are not there.
  Barbara


------------------------------

From: "Maria Arango" <maria@mariarango.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:05:40 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17265] paper help!  


> >This page contains the key block for the Boy Scout print I've 
> been gabbing >about. Very large .jpg in there so don't be whining about load time.
>if you like, go to the following link and please vote for your favorite name 
>and snicker at the others. I would much appreciate your help, although I'm leaning...

> >http://www.1000woodcuts.com/survey/survey.html

> >Maria

> Is there a prize for pickin the right name?
>
> Graham
>
>


No prizes, sorry, I haven't got paid yet! Interesting though, how my
perception of "the right name" changed after seeing the results of the
survey. 38 voted, thank you very kindly. I will leave up for a couple more
days before I settle on the name.
The scouts wanted to have the process available as a curiosity type of
attraction, so I'm working up a sort of e-booklet with step by step. I
should have that little project done by the end of 2005 the latest.

Another question on that, I ordered BFK Heavyweight Buff for the paper. I
was searching for a paper that was beefy yet supple and relatively smooth so
it can be printed dry, oh and in a buff shade. Also, it has to be 30" x 40"
(approx. 77 x 102 cm) and have 4 deckle edges. I have Arches Cover Buff, but
it is a bit too grainy and hard. I also have Okawara but the torn edges
don't look "deckle" enough. If anyone has a suggestion for a substitute, I
will take note since Graphic is out (although I have backordered) and so are
those other guys  [:-)] 

Gayle, I actually think that water, that wonderful yet deceivingly powerful
substance, might be harder on the baren cover than the extra muscle applied
when printing with oils. Especially here in drier climates, things in
general (baren covers, brushes, wood, etc.) are fine until they get wet,
then when they dry again (and that happens rather quickly) they crackle and
disintegrate into crumbs. As long as something stays dry in the first place,
seems to be okay.  I think it has to do with capillary action and with
single-digit humidity sucking the life out of everything. I might have made
some of that up. I think it's time for more coffee.

Maria

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Maria Arango
Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
http://www.1000woodcuts.com
maria@mariarango.com
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><>


------------------------------

From: "Lee and Barbara Mason" <bemason@concentric.net>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:11:36 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17266] Re: paper help!  

Maria,
I like arches 88, but also no deckel edges. Why don't you get a bunch of
different papers and try them?
BFK would work,  a little heavier than heayweight but a reall good paper.
Barbara

> Another question on that, I ordered BFK Heavyweight Buff for the paper. I
> was searching for a paper that was beefy yet supple and relatively smooth so
> it can be printed dry, oh and in a buff shade. Also, it has to be 30" x 40"
> (approx. 77 x 102 cm) and have 4 deckle edges. I have Arches Cover Buff, but
> it is a bit too grainy and hard. I also have Okawara but the torn edges
> don't look "deckle" enough. If anyone has a suggestion for a substitute, I
> will take note since Graphic is out (although I have backordered) and so are
> those other guys  [:-)] 
>
>


------------------------------

From: Vishnovus@aol.com
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:22:38 EST
Subject: [Baren 17267] registration 

Ive been trying to follow the discussions on registration and started reading 
about Kento method . How is this done if the paper itself is not perfectly 
straight...deckled or torn edges example..?
Ld

------------------------------

From: G Wohlken <blueman@pantek.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:28:17 -0500
Subject: [Baren 17268] Using real barens for oil based prints-cooking 
parchment for slip sheets 

I think it's interesting some of us are using heat on our paper.  I know 
a bookbinder who was told by a book arts guild master that heat should 
never be used on paper.  

I feel encouraged to try my real baren again, using the slip sheets.  I 
have a lot of cooking parchment, too, as I use it to form packets for 
cooking salmon fillets in the oven.

Thanks for all the ideas.  

Gayle     

    




------------------------------

From: "Lee and Barbara Mason" <bemason@concentric.net>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 08:25:09 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17269] registration  

Good question...you cut a small straight corner in the right hand corner and
another small flat spot for the left hand kento registration. So in two
places you lose the deckel edge.Or, you glue a corner on the back of the
paper that can easily be removed with water. Or tape a corner on the back of
the paper. Some printers put a drop of clear nail polish on the right hand
corner if they have to do a lot of printing on one paper, to keep it from
fraying with handling. I think Dave does this in his editions. I usually
don't worry about the deckel edge for hanga, assuming it will be framed
eventually anyway.
Barbara


> Ive been trying to follow the discussions on registration and started

reading

> about Kento method . How is this done if the paper itself is not perfectly
> straight...deckled or torn edges example..?
> Ld
>



------------------------------

From: Graham <gscholes@woodblock.info>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:10:05 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17270] Re: paper help! 


>No prizes, sorry,


Darn.....


>Especially here in drier climates, things in
>general (baren covers, brushes, wood, etc.) are fine until they get wet,
>then when they dry again (and that happens rather quickly) they crackle and
>disintegrate into crumbs. As long as something stays dry in the first place,
>seems to be okay.  I think it has to do with capillary action and with
>single-digit humidity sucking the life out of everything. I might have made
>some of that up. I think it's time for more coffee.


If your baren gets wet when using I suggest your paper is too wet.
The amount of moisture in paper should be hardly discernible.
Cold to the touch but not feel wet. 
Remember to turn the takenokawa from time to time.


>crackle and disintegrate into crumbs.


Too much tequila

Graham

------------------------------

From: Graham <gscholes@woodblock.info>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:19:19 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17271] Re: registration 


>Ive been trying to follow the discussions on registration and started reading
>about Kento method . How is this done if the paper itself is not perfectly
>straight...deckled or torn edges example..?
>Ld


Since we cannot send attachments I will send you one privately, which explains the deal.

Are you on a Mac or Windoz

Graham

Just so you know.... 
Mac's account for only 10% of the computers used.
But it is the top 10%.

------------------------------

From: Graham <gscholes@woodblock.info>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:28:43 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17272] Re: registration 

If you float mount a print you need not be concerned about the small 
kento cut on corner and bottom edge.  Some say that this is proof it 
was printed traditionally by hand with a baren.

That flat spot location for the left hand is depending on the size of 
the print. The attachment I offered will show this in relationship to the paper size.

Graham/Sidney BC
An Island in the Pacific
Home of the Boot Camp
http://woodblock.info 

>Good question...you cut a small straight corner in the right hand corner and
>another small flat spot for the left hand kento registration. So in two
>places you lose the deckel edge.Or, you glue a corner on the back of the
>paper that can easily be removed with water. Or tape a corner on the back of
>the paper. Some printers put a drop of clear nail polish on the right hand
>corner if they have to do a lot of printing on one paper, to keep it from
>fraying with handling. I think Dave does this in his editions. I usually
>don't worry about the deckel edge for hanga, assuming it will be framed
>eventually anyway.
>Barbara


------------------------------

From: "Bill H Ritchie Jr" <ritchie@seanet.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:31:33 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17273] Nitric + zinc = wood better 

Regarding Jean Eger Womacks encounters with teaching and some printmaking
techniques.

I'm completing a DVD that features Claire Van Vliet showing my 1982 etching
class how to make relief plates by etching zinc with nitric.

It's all part of my 40-year retrospective. What good is a retrospective if I
don't learn from it? And why not share it?

So what am I learning? Why is it pertinent?

Looking back, yes, there is a kind of elitism in art schools, but I call it
fascism. We were, as printmaking art teachers, the art school fascists.

Fortunately for some of us we saw it was time to change, and change I did. I
still labor over this "teaching" video, but what I hope sensible art
teachers--especially those beloved printmaking teachers, see the error
inherent in asking students to follow the archaic practices of the past
centuries.

They simply need to get with the times. There's ferric, of course, and also
electrolytic etching if you must use metals.

But wood is better. What a blessing to a tree if its bones contribute to the
making of a fine block and a fine work of art.

As Forrest Gump would say, "That's all I have to say about that."

Smile.


Bill H. Ritchie, Jr
500 Aloha #105
Seattle WA 98109
(206) 285-0658
mailto:ritchie@seanet.com
Web sites:
Professional: www.seanet.com/~ritchie
Virtual Gallery and E-Store: www.myartpatron.com
First Game Portal: www.artsport.com


------------------------------

From: Daniel Dew <ddew@tampabay.rr.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:35:36 -0500
Subject: [Baren 17274] New ideas 



I'm so excited about this music exchange!
I am going to do something that will blow everyone's mind.
A mix between Escher and Dr. Sues.
Who nelly.


Daniel L. Dew
http://www.dandew.com/
ddew@tampabay.rr.com




------------------------------

From: "Jean Eger Womack" <jeaneger@jeaneger.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:51:34 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17275] Re:   Baren Digest V18 #1743  

Well, I'll say this for the professors at SFSU.  My printmaking prof made me
buy a breathing apparatus, like a gas mask.  I don't know if there were any
fumes from the neutralizing operation because my face was covered with
plastic--plastic safety glasses too.  Of course it helps that neither my
husband nor myself drink, so we don't have to worry about accidents while we
are drinnking.  It really increases the safety level quite a bit.  He does
hazmat work for the City of Novato.  I took great satisfaction in telling
him that the opposite of acid is ALKALINE, not caustic.  Now that I think
about it, the opposite of acid is base.  What's the answer, folks?  Who
remembers their high school chemistry?

Jean


------------------------------

From: "Philip Smith" <SmithArt@Pacifier.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:55:53 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17276] Dropping Out  



I'm afraid I'll be dropping out of the Music Exchange.
Last week I came down with a case of Dell's palsy. Not permanent but seeing
out of my non-blinking left eye makes it difficult to see, and work.
My apologizes,
Philip
Hammond, OR
USA




------------------------------

From: FurryPressII@aol.com
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 14:58:57 EST
Subject: [Baren 17277] Re: paper help! 

What is the point of deckle edges on machine made paper?   rofl deckles are 
the result of hand made paper.  They are not natural to machine made paper.  
You should see the reaction of paper makers when I cut off deckles for 
registration purposes.

john center

------------------------------

From: "Maria Arango" <maria@mariarango.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:24:53 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17278] Re: paper help!  


> What is the point of deckle edges on machine made paper?   rofl
> deckles are
> the result of hand made paper.  They are not natural to machine
> made paper.


They're purdy!
Cosmetic enhancement only, John, they look nice if the print is floated as
this one will be.

By the way y'all, thanks for the nice comments on the name (and interesting
new suggestions!). I'm still laughing over the "passing wind" comments, some
of those Merrican expressions I didn't learn in Spain. Good thing you caught
that! Oh, and who voted 5 times???? Sneakyyy...
M


------------------------------

From: barebonesart <barebonesart@attbi.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:29:58 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17279] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743 

Jean,
In order to completely neutralize the acid you must add soda until it does
not foam any longer. If it was perfectly good acid it would have taken a ton
of soda.  Much better to bottle it up and take it to the haz/mat place in
your locale, or better yet, take it back to the place you bought it. They
will ususally take it and put it with their residue which goes to haz/mat
hell on their time.

Sharri



------------------------------

From: Aqua4tis@aol.com
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 17:25:01 EST
Subject: [Baren 17280] Re: Dropping Out 

philip
   i hope youll be feeling better soon
georga

------------------------------

From: G Wohlken <blueman@pantek.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 18:45:03 -0500
Subject: [Baren 17281] Re: Baren Digest V18 #1743 

A couple weeks ago Carol Lyon tried to send out the newspaper clipping 
about the Firemen's Benefit Show in Irvington, New York but didn't have 
too much success as not everyone could download it.  She sent me the 
clipping by snail mail, and I have scanned it in and Maria has put it up 
on Baren's Events and Activities page.  When you get there, click on  
the side bar title of "Irvington Library Gallery".  

http://barenforum.org/activities/activity_frame.html

Gayle
Ohio, USA




------------------------------

From: "Jean Eger Womack" <jeaneger@jeaneger.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 20:24:35 -0800
Subject: [Baren 17282] Re:   Baren Digest V18 #1742  

Now that I have been intimidated by high school teachers into neutralizing
my nitric acid that I use for etching zinc plates, I would like to point out
that it has created three gallon bottles of caustic soda, which are a
environmental hazard.  Whereas, before, I had one bottle of weak solution of
nitric acid, to which I could add fresh nitric once in awhile, now I have
three big bottles of hazardous waste.  If I want to etch again, I will have
to buy more nitric and then create three more large bottles of hazardous
waste, if I obey the Washington School teacher, one of whom wears a Chevron
lab coat.  Yes, my son also was concerned with the chemicals in my house,
but I did have the door locked when he brought the kids to visit.
    Perhaps it was the power of suggestion, but reading about Jeanne Norman
Chase's  studio fire (Jean & Norman chase?) may have caused someone to turn
on the fire under a pan in the kitchen while I was upstairs, because when I
went downstairs there was a fire on, under an empty pan.  I am normally
very, very careful about fire.  That's the second time it happened.  We have
had problems with fire before.  Early in our relationship, my husband put a
soaked newspaper on the floor furnace to dry it out, and then we both left
the house.  I didn't know he had done that, as I waited for him in the car.
When we came back, there were still embers floating in the air.  He spilled
some white gas in the basement and he said he would just leave it there, it
would evaporate.  But I demanded that he clean it up.  I don't know what he
needed boxes and boxes of extra nails for.  We would never need that many
nails, but he said he bought them at a thrift store.
    On the other hand, my husband is a sweet, loving man, always taking care
of my van (which belongs to him).  When the brakes failed, luckily I was not
going very fast in the parking lot of San Francisco State.  He was able to
repair the brakes.  I love it that he comes home every night and gets up
about the same time in the morning.  I love it that he has a steady job.
Occasionally we go to church together, but I no longer go to my stop
drinking club with him because they talked about drugs there more and more.
I don't want to have anything to do with drugs.
    The man next door, who is 70 years old, today proudly showed me his new
Harley Davidson motorcycle that he said he built while Howard was watching.
He has a license plate on it that reads "Mafia."  He has signs all over his
property that say "mafia."  I am beginning to think he might be in the
mafia.  I miss seeing his wife, becaue she died from cancer several years
ago.  It bothered me that he kept saying they treat a dog better than that.
Why don't they put her out of her misery? he used to say.  I did not
actually see his wife when she was sick.  I only saw her when she was having
a little bit of back pain, enough to keep her from walking very much.
    Sorry to burden you with all this whining and complaining.  I want to
avoid having my studio torched.  I don't know what other precautions we can
take.  I don't smoke and neither does Howard.  We have smoke alarms.  We
don't use the fireplace.
Jean Eger Womack

------------------------------

End of Baren Digest V18 #1744
*****************************