Delivery-Agent: @(#)$Id: local.c,v 1.54 1998/10/30 06:30:53 akira1 Exp $ on trader Received: by j.xx.or.jp (ATSON-1) ; 29 Jan 2000 15:40:23 +0900 Return-Path: Received: from lancer.xx.or.jp (lancer.xx.or.jp [202.224.39.3]) by trantula.xx.or.jp (8.8.8/3.7W) with ESMTP id PAA26246 for ; Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:40:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from ml.xx.or.jp (ml.xx.or.jp [202.224.39.111]) by lancer.xx.or.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id B21DE48E2 for ; Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:40:22 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) by ml.xx.or.jp (8.8.8/3.7W) with SMTP id PAA07174; Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:37:45 +0900 Received: by ml.xx.or.jp; Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:37:45 +0900 Received: (from ml@localhost) by ml.xx.or.jp (8.8.8/3.7W) id PAA38166 for baren-digest-outgoing; Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:37:45 +0900 Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:37:45 +0900 Message-Id: <200001290637.PAA38166@ml.xx.or.jp> From: owner-baren@ml.xx.or.jp To: baren@ml.xx.or.jp Subject: Baren Digest V10 #880 Reply-To: baren@ml.xx.or.jp Errors-To: owner-baren@ml.xx.or.jp Precedence: bulk [Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking. Sender: owner-baren-digest@ml.xx.or.jp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=unknown-8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by trantula.xx.or.jp id PAA26246 X-Mozilla-Status: 0000 Baren Digest Saturday, 29 January 2000 Volume 10 : Number= 880 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 16:38:08 -0600 Subject: [Baren 8014] Baren Exchange Library Exhibit - Announcement=20 It seems like Baren is having a coming out party! Exhibits everywhere...........Last year Kyoto and Manhattan, this year Chicago (Skokie), Uganda & Australia........geez...and we are only i= n January! How many continents is that Dave ? I announced back in December plans for a spring exhibition of selected pr= ints from Baren exchanges #1- #4. The exhibit will be on display at the Skokie Public Library (near Chicago) fr= om April 3 thru May 3, 2000. The Skokie library is a showcase for the Chicago northshore area and considered a "research" library by Chicago media because of it's resources. It averages 2000+ visitors daily with larger numbers on the we= ekend. The theme of the exhibit is "Baren" and the members coming together thru the net. With that in mind my goal = is to display at least one print from each of the participating members in #1- #4. The library has given us about 160' of = wall display and I am happy to announce that the show will display 85+ prints representing close to 60 Baren members. In addition, I am preparing a large (4' X 4') display panel to exhibit all the New Year dragon cards.....bringing the number o= f participating bareners to close to 70 members or about 1/2 of our active forum membership. The Skokie library will publish & announce the exhibit in their monthly publications. In addition the library will provide professional staff for hanging the prints, will setup a PC in the lobby dedicated around the clock to the Baren web-site, will mail announcement cards to approx. 200 local = Chicago art patrons (galleries, museums, media, collectors, bareners, etc). Also a glass display case might be m= ade available for displaying tools, brushes, woodblocks, etc. I will be creating two large introductory display panel= s explaining....Baren and woodblock printmaking. For a tour of the library display areas go here: http://www.skokienet.org/bandits/jcrstuff/library.html My thanks to the many who have sent emails offering help with the show an= d the matting & framing of the prints. Because this is such a large project an I am somewhat isolated from other barener= s here in the midwest, I have been discussing the library exhibit framework with Baren's council of past exchange coord= inators to ensure a successful outcome. Here is what the council has discussed and agreed upon: - -The single most expensive aspect of such a project is the display aspe= cts of such a large volume of works. We agreed that a contribution of $15 from each participating exchange member would = help defer the cost of frames and other exhibit expenses such as printing announcement cards and providing "stuff" for th= e opening ceremony (each participating member will receive 5 announcement cards). Once the exhibit is done my pr= ints will go back to their folios and the frames become property of "Baren" proper to be used by any other member wishing to tackle another "Baren" exhibit. The way we see this working is that the frames will sit in my g= arage till someone else needs them for their show. Shipping of the frames to the next location will be paid with any l= eftover money from the previous show or by contributions made by "new" exchange participants (#5, #6, etc...) joinin= g the group. Because of the expenses involved, it may not be practical to ship frames outside continental USA, so this "traveling" road show may only apply for members based here. Although not every upcoming Baren show would need 80-100 frames....after a few shows....we could end up having frames all over the country and thus facilitating the mounting of= local exhibits. To look at the frames go here: http://www.skokienet.org/bandits/jcrstuff/libframes.html - - My prints (collection) is on display...but not for sale. Thus I will = need to know if you care to sell any additional copies of your prints you may have in you possession. There will be a master price = list kept at the registration desk for any interested buyers. Contact could be made via the title card (each print = will have a title card indicating title, artist, city, country, email & website address) or by interested buyers contacting m= e locally and I will provide phone number of artist. There will also be a master list of all artists participating near the introductory panels. - - Sometime during the next week or two I will need some info from you. = I am putting together a database that will hopefully help this and other future exhibits. How this info will be collected (web= -form or private emails) is still being worked on. I will need current email & website info plus prices on any print(s) you = would like to sell. If you don't want to have your info displayed...just let me know and I will honor that request. To find out more about the Skokie Public Library and what they offer....g= o here: http://www.skokie.lib.il.us Some last notes: I will also be contacting a handful of ex-bareners-exchange-participants = to inform them of this opportunity and to offer them a chance to contribute. In reality....unless you have participated in only one exchange....you wi= ll probably have more than one print on display ( for a whole month...to be seen by 10's of thousands of people). All of = #4 will be up as I think the "meet the artists" wall should bring lot of attention. Also most of the prints from #1, #2 & #3 w= ill go up. The frames are 16 X 20 for #1 and #3 and 11 X 14 for #2 & #4 exchanges. I will be putting together the order for = the frames next week ...so............... If you have participated in exchanges #1 - #4 and would like to contribu= te to this project ........please take a few minutes to put a check in the mail ( $15, made out to me) within the next couple of days....my visa card will be eternally grateful. Julio Rodriguez 3801 Dobson Skokie, Illinois 60076 I am very excited to be working on this project, although I have never do= ne a show this large before, I feel this is a good way to payback "Baren" for the countless hours of education and fun I ha= ve received during the last three years. If you have any comments or concerns.....please feel free to send me a po= st directly or to Baren if it's of a general topic.relating to this exhibit............ Thanks.......Julio ------------------------------ From: Gary Luedtke Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 17:39:59 -0500 Subject: [Baren 8015] Re: bad print framing charset=3DISO-8859-1=20 Wanda, < Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 15:39:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Baren 8016] Re: bad print framing=20 Thanks,Patsy! What you need is patience and to know how to draw.Getting down on paper what you visualise is going to be the hardest thing you'll encounter in art! regards, Dimitris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: =3D?iso-8859-1?q?dimitris=3D20grammatikopulos?=3D Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 15:42:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Baren 8017] bad framing=20 Hello, Wanda! adding to my previous suggestion I would like one of the following to happen: 1.a close scan of those stains on the bird's back 2.a close scan of the back of the print in the same area,and 3.a close examination by you of those stains using a good magnifying lens(x4-x6) and you let me know if these are growing (and living) things. As for the use of steam,so as to peel off ANY sticky things from paper,there shouldn't be any problem if you simply cover with something plastic the area you don't want affected.My mistake,for considering that self-understood.Besides,although this print is not what you can call really old (my estimation 1910-1920,give or take 10 years),still the pain= t is beyond reviving,especially after a 3-4 minutes' steam bath.Personally,I've treated my own prints that way. I'd like to hear about the results, regards, Dimitris __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ From: Wanda Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 16:22:41 -0800 Subject: [Baren 8018] Re: bad print framing=20 Thank you Gary, I did look through the only Shin Hanga book I own myself (Ukio-e to shin Hanga, the art of Japanese Prints) but couldn't find any marks that look like these. Of course, this book really only hits the high spots of Hanga from the very beginning to almost modern day. The margins are held fast to the back of the mat by masking tape, stuck almost all the way around the print. I don't want to peel it off until I'm sure I won't do any more damage to it. There are some brown paper remnants along the top edge of the print, as though it was glued at some time to a backing sheet of some kind, plus some little squares along the margins like really old scotch tape. You know, the kind that came off and left a yellow residue on the paper from the glue. I can't see anything written or printed on the edges, they also look like someone trimmed them to about 1/2" all the way around, except on the top edge - the paper's deckle edge is still intact there. Wanda ------------------------------ From: Gary Luedtke Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 19:25:26 -0500 Subject: [Baren 8019] Re: bad print framing charset=3DISO-8859-1=20 Wanda, I've done a little research and I think we've got it. Your "Heron" pri= =3D nt is by Ohara Shoson, I believe. Quite a popular Shin Hanga bird-man. I= =3D n the book by Hugo Munsterberg, "The Japanese Print-A Historical Guide", =3D there is a print by Shoson nearly identical to yours, only the bird is poised differently. It is titled, " Heron in Rain", printed about 1935, b= =3D y Watanabe. It looks like the same bird, same background, only yours is standing on his left foot, with beak horizontal, and the Munsterberg bird= =3D is standing on his right foot, with beak down. Your print bears the Watanabe seal, and as Watanabe was probably the publisher of highest reknown doing Shin Hanga prints, it is highly unlike= =3D ly they would publish such an amazingly similar print by anyone else, therefore I am almost certain it is by Ohara Shoson. I have not been able, however, to find a clear image of his personal seal anywhere to confirm this. Incidentally, your version appears superior to the Munsterberg bird. =3D I'd say you bought wisely! The size of the Watanabe seal is probably the only indicator, if there is= =3D no date in the margin, as to whether this is a first edition, or later edition print. In terms of value, if it is a first edition, or done duri= =3D ng the artist's lifetime, it's value is higher. If it is a posthumous edition, it will be lower. I believe the best advice is to have a professional restorer assess the possibilities for it's restoration, not = =3D to do anything to it yourself. If this is a first edition print, I believe= =3D it's value, barring unseen damage, may be several hundred dollars, minimu= =3D m! If posthumous, probably not much less than that. =3D You might measure the diameter of the Watanabe seal in millimeters. Th= =3D is can help determine the edition of this print. Prints they did in later years, or posthumous printings, usually were 6 or 7 mm, first edition prints 5 or 6. I'm not sure which just now, I'll check on it. Gary ------------------------------ From: Gary Luedtke Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 19:47:39 -0500 Subject: [Baren 8020] Re: bad print framing charset=3DISO-8859-1=20 Wanda, "I can't see anything written or printed on the edges, they also look lik= =3D e someone trimmed them to about 1/2" all the way around, except on the top edge - the paper's deckle edge is still intact there. If Watanabe used a margin seal, or date, it would be directly adjacent to= =3D the border of the print, and well within that half inch. If you are not= =3D familiar with Watanabe seals, I suggest you go to Hanga.com, where Robin has an excellent little directory of Watanabe seals, and you'll pick up some more info pertinent to your print, no doubt. But Watanabe did not always print in margins, particularly later editions. The seal however = =3D is Watanabe's, we just can't be sure without further research, when it may have been printed. It was not uncommon, also, not to have the deckled edges all around. That seems to be a more recent preference, I haven't seen many older prints that have it. =3D You may be able to take the print off the matte by cutting through the ta= =3D pe on the matte, not on the print. Leave the tape there until you have a professional assess the damages and offer options for cleaning it up. B= =3D ut then you can scan it again in its frontal entirety for further study. =3D I didn't notice the black stain down the back that Dimitris mentioned, though it looked like it may have a slight amount of "foxing", but that's= =3D hard to tell without seeing it in person. When I printed out the image from your scan, and pieced the two together, I didn't notice it at all. Congratulations on acquiring a fine print. Gary ------------------------------ From: B Mason Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 17:15:39 -0800 Subject: [Baren 8021] Re: speed=20 Andrea, I think 30 prints a day is a lot, these guys who do more are truly doing this as a full time job. The rest of us who are trying to fit it into our lives just don't have the stamina to print so many. I do know that I did do my edition for #3 all in two days after I started to print, I did 40 prints with 5 colors and 6 impressions, so I guess that would be about 200 times printing. The Hanga seems to go amazingly fast once you are set up to actually print. Of course, I still don't know what I am doing, so was just darn pleased to get it done. Barbara Rich wrote: > Wow Dave,I moan and groan about printing a run of 30 a day. My block > sizes are larger, 16" x 20" about, and I am printing with oil base ink > so I take the block off the press, roll up the ink, apply it to the > block, clean the clear areas of the block by hand, return it to the > press, register the paper, and print. Your method must be much more > efficient. Still you have to deal with all the water issues. Keeping > a consistant amount of moisture in the paper and the ink. How many > proofs do the rest of you manage a day? Andrea Rich ------------------------------ From: "Philip Smith" Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 17:40:37 -0800 Subject: [Baren 8022] Re: At long last! charset=3D"iso-8859-1"=20 Jandi,......good luck with the new press,..I hope all goes well. Please g= et us updated,.... Philip ------------------------------ From: "John Ryrie" Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 12:20:22 +1100 Subject: [Baren 8023] Re: bad print framing charset=3D"iso-8859-1"=20 Welcome Patsy I'd like to ask a question of everyone. I'm planning a studio for printmaking and painting, and would like to know what is the one thing th= at you feel is essential. Assuming that you already have a roof, It depends on what type of printin= g you want to do. A Baren or a printing press? John ------------------------------ From: "John Ryrie" Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 12:09:27 +1100 Subject: [Baren 8024] Re: bad print framing charset=3D"iso-8859-1"=20 Wanda said > Hi everyone - thank you, Jack,Josephine, Dimitris, Barbara, & Jan! I > have a quick & dirty & (sorry) big scan of this print up at: > > http://web-ster.com/robertson/Cranescan > Nice Print Wanda There is a print quite similar to this one on Page 301 o= f Masters of the Japanese print by Richard Lane, Thames & Hudson 1962. It'= s called Heron in the Rain Late 1870's by Kyosai. John ------------------------------ From: David Bull Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 12:03:22 +0900 Subject: [Baren 8025] Re: bad print framing=20 Wanda, Gary came up with just the same thing that I had thought when I saw your image. Hoson, of course! But looking more closely, I see that the print is indeed different from his famous heron in snow image. And the signature too doesn't match. =20 I think you should head over to the Japanese Prints Bulletin Board at: http://www.shogungallery.com/wwwboard/wwwboard.html ... and post your inquiry there, along with your image link. Those guys just love digging around to find the background to prints like this (as long as you don't start asking dumb questions like "What is it worth?"). I think you'll be almost guaranteed to get some good info in reply ... Dave ------------------------------ From: Maria Arango Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 19:29:27 -0800 Subject: [Baren 8026] Re: speed and press info=20 > How many proofs do the rest of you manage a day? > > Andrea Rich > On an average energetic day, I used to print 2 states of a reduction print in one day, an edition of 50. Like you, Andrea, my block sizes are between 8x10 to 12x24, sometimes I tackle something bigger(!). This was by hand, with my patented mushroom baren ;-) cutting the block in between, a total of about 100 plus proofs. Nowhere close to the masters, I'm afraid. Now with the press, I don't really print more in one day, but I can have more projects going simultaneously because fatigue of the upper body is no longer a factor. I have probably doubled my output for a week's work, but this also means more days have to be dedicated to matting, framing, taking slides, making contacts, entering exhibitions, chucking rejection letters in the trash, etc.etc. Ah, the wonderful varied tasks of the artist! By the way, my press, a 24" x 36" came from Dan Patrick Designs (danpat@comox.island.net). Cost was roughly U.S. $875 with steel stand and micro-gauges, plus another $200 for shipping from Canada. It is worth its weight in gold. Their presses start at around $400 for a 12 x 24 table model and go up to $1500 for a 36" x 48" with stand plus shipping. Can't beat that! Essentials for a studio? Are we talking an artist's studio or a full-blown teaching studio? Julio, my check's in the mail! Thank you for all the work you are doing. Thanks also to Gregory for putting together the Kampala show. Health to all, Maria - -- <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Maria Arango, Printmaker The Printmaking Studio http://www.printmakingstudio.com <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> ------------------------------ From: SKHeidel@aol.com Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 23:38:13 EST Subject: [Baren 8027] Re: bad print framing=20 ------------------------------ From: Gregory Robison Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 07:24:05 +0300 Subject: [Baren 8028] Essential items for studio=20 Kampala, 29 January 2000 patsy giclas wrote: > I'm planning a studio for printmaking and painting, and would= like to know what is the one thing that you feel is essential. Patsy: In my case, the missing item that caused me the most headache was a flat = file (i.e., a cabinet with shallow, very wide and deep drawers). I found= that I couldn't locate paper that I knew I had, couldn't allow paper tha= t arrived rolled to "relax" by lying flat, couldn't correctly and safely = store works of art on paper that I acquired, found that some items (both = raw material and finished works) had suffered damage from too much handl= ing and moving around the studio, was often surprised by cat prints on clean, expensive hosho, etc. The top of a flat file can double= as a work surface (especially good at stand-up height), and I have also = found it is hard to get around the need for at least one, clear surface t= hat is about the size of the largest paper you handle (not the largest yo= u print or paint). >From a theoretical point of view, the essential item should be the one w= ith the most overlap or utility with the various artistic endeavors you e= xpect to undertake. Once again, in my case, whether I'm doing watercolor= , printmaking, sketching, acquiring other people's work, some simple book= arts, letterpress printing... I'm handling paper. That's the common thr= ead, and it's likely to be the common thread in the future. "Follow the = paper" would be the best advice on how to plot the workflow in my studio, and where the "mission-critical" nodes are (to use engineer ta= lk). I tried many ways to circumvent this lack, and balked at buying a file be= cause they're awfully expensive. They can be pretty massive, too, and ma= ny people have relatively modestly-sized studios, or fear having to move = from one eighth-floor walk-up to another... I have lived with stop-gap s= olutions till now, and will only take delivery of my new flat file next w= eek. It's custom made out of local tropical hardwood (but with hardware = -- drawer slides and casters -- ordered on the Internet) with inside drawer dimensions of 33 x 45 (inches). It's big, it's expensive (for this place), it's heavy. But it's general-= purpose, which means I will use it practically every day; and my 7 year o= ld daughter will be able to store her children's work in it when the time= comes (will she find any use for anything else in my studio? Even the c= hair? I wonder.) Welcome to the group! Gregory Robison ------------------------------ From: SKHeidel@aol.com Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 23:59:37 EST Subject: [Baren 8029] RE: Christina on constructive criticism=20 Christina shared:"I remind my students of these points a lot! We do critiques at the end of every project. It's hard at first, they never want to say anything bad about their friends. Then they have to learn to give a complement and constructive criticism. I struggle with this everyday. But my reward is when I walk by a table and they are giving critiques during production, when they become the teacher, and begin to help share and guide each other. I agree with we need more constructive criticism on the list. I've done criticism with kindergarten through 5th and with currently teach 7th and 8th, I have watched my students skills grow exponentially. I think we can learn a lot form each other, I already do....:) (big smile)" What a great insight. Thanks for sharing that. This can be applied to soo= ooo=20 many aspects of life and art. Music, cooking, writing, just think of how= =20 often we would benefit from constructive criticism. So okay, we create to= =20 please ourselves and THEN we please others, but, lets face it we seek=20 approval and admiration from others, we just don't always know how to get= it.=20 And dealing with disapproval is something I hope to master in the third=20 quarter of my life....between the time I am 90 and 120 years old. Sandy ------------------------------ From: David Bull Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 14:05:24 +0900 Subject: [Baren 8030] Printing process photos ...=20 For those who might want to 'follow along' during this next week as I work on that surimono print, inspecting the colour separations and each block, I have prepared a new set of pages over on my own website. =20 Head over to: http://w.com/surimono ... and select the 'How These Prints are Made' link. Scroll down the page, and you will find a new section on this current print. The first colour block was done this morning, but the next won't go up until maybe tomorrow, as I have to head out this evening to a meeting of the traditional craftsmen's association. Dave ------------------------------ From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 23:24:56 -0600 Subject: [Baren 8031] re: Wanda's Crane...me too!=20 I have also seen you print somewhere.....need to look around....so many b= ooks. That's a fine print and a fantastic find. I have lost your orignal post....where did you find this ? how much did y= ou pay ? Enjoy! Julio ------------------------------ From: Wanda Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 22:19:56 -0800 Subject: [Baren 8032] Re: bad print framing=20 Thanks for all the suggestions, everyone. I have put up a couple of details on the site - a scan of part of the back (so you can see that lovely tape!) and a closeup of the little brown spots (don't appear to be alive, just a stain I think) and a more detailed scan of the chop marks & calligraphy (Heron in Rain?) I had started calling it "Crane in Rain" heeheehee - better get out my bird book again. Well, enough excitement for today. Sorry for taking up so much band-width. I'm just so darned excited! Oh, here is the up-dated URL: http://web-ster.com/robertson/Cranescan/image/ I'll call the Museum on Monday morning & I posted a question on the shogun gallery site. When I find out more, I'll let you all know.=20 Wanda ------------------------------ From: Wanda Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 22:39:14 -0800 Subject: [Baren 8033] Re: Wanda's Crane...me too!=20 I found it in an antique store about 15 miles from where I live & I paid $59.00 for it. So I hope it was worth $59! But, if not - I love the thing anyway. What price can you put on love, anyway? :-) Wanda Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com wrote: > I have lost your orignal post....where did you find this ? how much did= you pay > ? ------------------------------ From: Arafat Alnaim Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 22:40:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Baren 8034] LILLA EUROPA 2000=20 I have just received an invitation to participate in LILLA EUROPA 2000 1st Biennale of small-scale painting and printmaking Hallsberg & =D6rebro, Sweden. The purpose of LILLA EUROPA 2000 is to show the best from the most prominent European artist who make small-scale pictures. At the 1st Biennale of LILLA EUROPA 2000 Tow awards will be given to tow artists Award of painting 5.000 SEK Award of printmaking 5.000 SEK. For those of you who are interested in this please contact me on arafat@mail.wowmail.com to send you address and more information. Greetings=20 Arafat __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of Baren Digest V10 #880 ****************************