[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest               Friday, 7 August 1998       Volume 04 : Number 238

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Elizabeth Atwood <elizuno@midcoast.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 10:16:18 -0500
Subject: [Baren 1327] Exchange 

Baren Exchange........
Sounds like a great idea.......I will take part, if possible.

I have to echo Andrea concern on time concerns. AND I have never created an
edition larger than 30........and have reduced my output to considerably
less than that in the past few years.
Wow! Am I up to the task of a large edition??
The idea is irresistable.
I am trying to follow the discussion on this......but this is "house guest
time" in the state of Maine and it is difficult to find time to even read
the e-mail.
Onward........Bettie

------------------------------

From: Gayle Wohlken <blueman@pantek.com>
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 10:43:05 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1328] Re: Baren Digest V4 #237 

Regarding Oban:
>  (roughly 15 1/2 x 20 7/8 inches), 

So what we're saying is--we use this size, but we can print our image 
on it working from our own block size (which in my case would be 
probably 8 1/2" x 11")  Yes?  Will we use a specific type of paper?
A specific hue of paper?  I am accustomed to using kitakata, which
is a deep toned paper.  But I could certainly try something different.

* * * *
> I'm from Puerto Rico and I'm in Baren only for 2 weeks.

Haydee, welcome to Baren.  (I was beginning to wonder why we
attracted people from the U. S. and Canada and not too many other
places. 
Finally a couple people from Japan joined.

* * * * 

Dave, speaking of the above, I always wonder why we don't have
people from England in the Baren. 

* * * * 
http://www.inquo.net/~beckorro/woodcut/vill22a.jpg

Roger, I see a charming print (though it may have what Graham sees
as a lack of smoothness).  The texture to me is interesting, but then I
like the German Expressionists so I'm open to that look.  Eventually
you'll get what you want, but in the meantime the print is nice, and
I think you should join up in the exchange!

Gayle Wohlken

------------------------------

From: jimandkatemundie@juno.com (James G Mundie)
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:16:05 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1329] the exchange 81,83,85-87,89-90,93-94,96-99 

Roger wrote:
>Re: "Collection"   Well, personally I was hanging back figuring that 
>I'd get in "next time" after I "got better."  I decided it would patently
>unfair for me to offer in trade one of my latest _experiments_ for a 
>fully planned-out design by someone who has been doing this for years.

Roger,
	As  Dave has said, this exchange is meant to be a collection of
peers, and should reflect the work of as many possible [Baren] members as
possible.  What better sums up this group than work by "pros" and
"newbies".  Whether widely experienced or not, we're all learning here or
else we wouldn't be writing and reading messages on the list.
	You have nothing whatsoever to be embarrassed about-- and I'm
saying that without even having looked at your new image yet.  Put aside
your fears and jump on! 

>I know I still have tons to learn but I'm having a great time!

That's the whole idea, boyo.

*** 

Graham wrote:
>Please Jim....Mr. Scholes was my father's name....Mine is Graham.

Wow, Graham... your father never had a first name?  ;-)

>I will  make my own box.

Fair enough.

>>How does this sound?  Commitment deadline... 1 September 1998
>>                                  Completion deadline...   1 February1999
>Fabulous. Perfect. Bang on the money. GO FOR IT. Carve it in Stone

>OBAN  Standard print 15" x 10" (39 x 26cm)
>Fabulous. Perfect. Bang on the money. GO FOR IT. Carve it in Stone

I'm sharpening my chisels and looking for my favorite mallet.  If no one
can offer a more convincing arguement by tommorow, the above deadlines
and oban will become the standard.

***

April wrote:
>Sounds like a great project! Six months and oban size sounds about 
>right to me... 
>In any case, with all this enthusiasm how can it fail to be a fabulous
>collection of prints? Count me in, too.

Good.  That's seventeen.  Eighteen if Roger stops hanging back...

***

Haydee wrote:
>I work color woodcuts by hand or press and for me 5 month is OK... 
>I think that is important to  know if we want  unity or diversity
concept in the >portfolio.   

Both.  Diversity will come in the form of varied images, techniques,
styles, etc.
Unity comes from a uniform size paper and the fact that we are all
printing from wood and members of this wonderful forum.

***

Gary wrote:
>I've kept silent while all this talk of a print exchange has gone on
>because unlike most, if not all of you, I have designed prints but 
>never _made_ them.    I am not aloof from this exchange, only have nothing 
>to offer.   The best I could do would be a computer print out of one of 
>my designs, but of course that would only be on color printer paper.   I
>know Graham would be tearing his beard out if I were to attempt to pass one 
>of those off as a contribution, so I'll respectfully pass on participating in
>this, but of course I'll continue to participate in Baren.

That's fine Gary... unless you think you could get a block to and from
Japan in time? ;-) 
 
You rightly predicted Graham's reaction, I think; but I would have had to
bar a computer printed print from the exchange anyway (unless you've got
a wooden laser printer?).  

Keep it in mind for next year though, Gary.  I think we'd all love to
have one of your images included at some point.

Mise le meas,
James Mundie, Philadelphia USA

------------------------------

From: "Roger A. Ball" <beckorro@inquo.net>
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 09:47:08 -0600
Subject: [Baren 1330] Comments 

Graham:  
Thanks for the comments.  The Stonehenge was left moistening between layers
of newsprint overnight.  (I am fortunate enough to be able to get unused
"roll ends" from the newspaper.)   I found the texture pleasing on both
sides and I felt that it was taking the pigment up evenly.  Overall I am
very pleased with both Stonehenge and Rives BFK for a surface.  Yes, I
suspect there are lots of little tricks that I need to try or need to
learn.  However, the "speckled" portion you point out in that particular
print is simply me using too much pigment--as you first thought.  I'm just
beginning to learn that a little pigment goes a long way; especially after
the color begins to build on the block.  That, and difficulty laying the
pigment smoothly causes puddling.  Other prints had better skies, but were
screwed up some other way.  I can't blame the paper.  Thanks again... and I
wish I had a press.

Dave:
Thank you for some very constructive criticism.  I appreciate your ability
to look so caringly at something so far removed from your tradition.  This
set of prints gave me more experience and helped me to learn a lot.  While
I didn't know before, now I know (as you and Graham pointed out) I need
less water and more ricepaste.  Certainly I'm after greater contrast,
detail, and smoother color.  And sometimes during this run I got it.
Sometimes I didn't.  But after printing twelve, I know a hell of a lot
more.  Moisture balance, more paste and laying out the pigment more
smoothly should help.  My color choices should be better next time, too.

If Dave says that he would like me aboard on the exchange, I'll throw my
hat in thinking that by January I ought to be capable of producing
something.  I would love to be able to _touch_ someone else's prints!
What, about thirty?? 15 1/2" x 10 1/2" prints?  Will someone suggest a
paper supplier here in the states?  My Daniel Smith catalog still isn't
here.  McLain's Hoso is 23" x 17", unsized, and about $3.50 a pop.  I
haven't looked at Dick Blick for awhile--I seem to remember they were
reasobnably priced...  Recommendations?

My intentions are to try something a bit more simple, more suited to color
seps and just do multiple blocks on mohagany-faced ply (since I have it on
hand).  Anyway, thanks to all.  Your comments are very helpful.  I'm
keeping at it.

Cheers!

Roger

------------------------------

From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 08:55:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1331] Re: New member ... new print ... 

Haydee wrote......
> Coqui is a unique portorrican small toad.  Coqui.net is a private company
> that offer internet  service in Puerto Rico.

I suppose one could say they are a small toad in a small country.....

> I work color woodcuts by hand or press and for me 5 month is OK.

Glad you are going to be involved ....welcome to the Baren.....watch out
for Gary.

Good feed back about the exchange you were involved in.

>The only thing that I don't like in that portfolio was the signature, in
>some prints were in the back of the paper not in the front.

Good point.. We should define this James.

May I ask are you 0+ or  0-  ???

Regards,

Graham

------------------------------

From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 08:55:20 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1332] Re: "Computer Art" 

Gary Luedtke
>I've kept silent while all this talk of a print exchange has gone on
>because unlike most, if not all of you, I have designed prints but never
>_made_ them.

I am wondering why?   I think I have said before that creation is all
important and the physical aspect of printmaking is secondary. However it
is the fun part of the fun.  It all depends on what doors you want to go
through...  Since I have taken on this project (printmaking and
lighthouses) I have become the grey hair boy of Public Gallery in several
parts of Canada.  When I finish the project I will be knocking on the
National Gallery's door.

>I am not aloof from this exchange, only have nothing to offer.

You should reverse that situation and get the ...........

>The best I could do would be a computer print out of one of my
>designs, but of course that would only be on color printer paper.

You got that right.... However you could sell them at craft shows as
decorative stuff. You could probably make enough money to buy some Hanga tools.

>Graham would be tearing his beard out if I were to attempt to pass one of
>those off as a contribution

Only if you tried to pass it off as Fine Art.

>so I'll respectfully pass on participating in
>this, but of course I'll continue to participate in Baren.

Oh GOOD. I would hate not to have someone to jibe with.....(<:

Graham

Now .....  look out Matt here I come......

------------------------------

From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 08:55:27 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1333] Re: "Computer Art" 

Matt wrote.....
>This designer is not so fortunate, or perhaps expert, enough to do that. I
>have to work through my designs, set them aside, see what bothers me, come
>back and revise, etc. etc.

So why should it be different for you than me or for that matter most of us.

>And this is where I find the computer very helpful.

I've been there done it and .......well, you know the rest.

>Jim Ulrich is his name.   At last, he came up with a pigment that is
>inexpensive, water-based, as rich as the minerals and probably fast.
>The beauty of it is that you do not need to moisten the paper before
>printing at all!

I'll let the computer thingie pass but must question this.....
If the pigments are waterbase and these are applied to dry paper. then the
moisture introduced, has to expand the paper and cause waviness and
distortion to the part where the ink is applied. That's OK until you come
to put down another colour....  No way could you register and get a fit.
You will have a fit but certainly not get a fit.

So what have I missed here??????  Pressing and Drying between colours!!!!

Graham

------------------------------

From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 08:55:33 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1334] Re: a sick joke 

This was sent by Ray and it is must for the Baren......

>I apologize for the punch line but this joke is not original.  It is older
>than dirt (or at least older than Graham) but I thought you might like it.
>You may have even heard it before. Too bad it isn't technical or you could
>share it with Baren.  (Sorry, I couldn't resist.)
>******************************************
>
>Recently, a guy in Paris nearly got away with stealing
>several paintings from the Louvre.
>
>However, after planning the crime, breaking in,
>evading security, getting out and escaping with the
>goods, he was captured only two blocks away when his
>Econoline van ran out of gas.
>
>When asked how he could mastermind such a crime and
>then make such an obvious error, he replied:
>
>
>
>-- (brace yourself)  --
>
>
>
>
>-- (this is going to hurt) --
>
>
>
>
>-- (here it comes) --
>
>
>
>
>-- (it is really corny...) --
>
>
>
>
>
>
>"I had no Monet to buy Degas to make the Van Gogh."
>
>Cheers
>From Ray

I love it Ray

Graham

------------------------------

From: jimandkatemundie@juno.com (James G Mundie)
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 12:28:39 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1335] printmaking competition 

	For any of you that may be interested, the prospectus for the
Print Center's [Philadelphia-- formerly "the Print Club"] 73rd Annual
Competition is viewable at:
http://www.libertynet.org/print/compet.html

This competition rotates annually between printmaking and photography. 
This year's juror is Andy Grunberg. 

You may want to also explore the other opportunities The Print Center
offers at:
http://www.libertynet.org/print/ops.html

Mise le meas,
James Mundie, Philadelphia PA 

------------------------------

From: Gary Luedtke <GLuedtke@compuserve.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 12:58:41 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1336] Re: "Computer Art" 

Graham wrote that by the time he finishes his current project he's going to
be knocking on the National Gallery's Door.  I thought for a moment he was
going to say Heaven's Door, like this current project is taking him under.
I hope you get in, (to the National Gallery) don't know if they'd let a
cantankerous fella like you in the other one.  I get your sign-off phrase
now, "Bang On".   I don't know though, Graham, how do they feel about nudie
protestors at the National?  I thought they were a pretty conservative
group there.

Thanks for your response, James.  I think Dave has his hands full, however,
if it was him you meant to carve and print my exchange contribution.  

Gary

------------------------------

From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 11:58:07 -0500
Subject: [Baren 1337] re:exchange plus 

Roger.....I saw your print(s) and I like it a lot. Great depth. I also got
somehow to your parent directory and browsed thru all the pics in your
web-site. I enjoyed looking thru all your efforts. Looks like you have some
great ideas. Looking forward to having you join the exchange!

Gary..........I understand your concerns...but let me say this.....your
prints ( or should I say...your designs)... those delicate pastel
landscapes views of yours ...are some of the most beautiful prints I have
seen here in Baren. Is there anyway you can include one of your print
designs ? Perhaps another Baren member  (someone with heavy-duty printing
experience) can volunteer to print one of your old blocks for you ?  I just
can't imagine a Baren exchange without having one of Gary's prints
included !

Any suggestions out there from Baren-land so we can help Gary out
????????????????

------------------------------

From: Gary Luedtke <GLuedtke@compuserve.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 17:01:26 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1338] re:exchange plus 

Thanks, Julio, for offering to include one of my prints in the exchange
though someone else would need to print it.  Problem there is that the
first edition was a numbered, limited edition.   While I do have the
blocks,  and someday if ever there is a demand, a second edition could be
run, I think it would be unethical to rub out another fifty for
private circulation, and prevail upon one of my colleagues to do it free to
boot!   To hire someone to print them is out of the question for this
exchange, both time and money wise.   In the future, I may not number the
edition, but leave it open ended, but what's done is done.   Thanks for the
thought however. 

Gary                      

------------------------------

From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 16:59:05 -0500
Subject: [Baren 1339] RE:EXCHANGE- edition #'s 

In an earlier posting....someone mentioned the idea....that all Baren
members would receive the same # print on their portfolio. For
example.....if I am number 14...all my prints would carry the "limited
edition #14" signature.  Of course when I make my prints....I would
hold/keep #14 and send the rest in to the distribution person/s. Is this
how you envision this portfolio ? 

If so, I would suggest that you/we assign a print # based on
the order that members signup for the exchange. With the originator of the
idea getting #1...(or perhaps the privilige should go to Dave for making
BAREN possible for everyone?) ......anyways..Each member would need to know
their # in order to keep that print at home. Is this what we had in mind
from that posting ? I think it would be "neat", "cool", "out-of-this-world",  
etc.  to have an exchange portfolio were all the prints match on the edition 
number. Does this happen often with
school-exchanges ?   Thanks...

JULIO

ps......one more day before I go away  to play..........!

------------------------------

From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Fri, 07 Aug 1998 08:00:13 +0900
Subject: [Baren 1340] Updates ... 

Those of you who haven't bumped into it already should check the new
Encyclopedia page - a 'photo essay' that shows Andrea's reduction
process in action.
http://www.woodblock.com/encyclopedia/updates.html

It'll take a minute or so to download, but the 20 or so photographs will
give you a pretty good idea of just how the magic works ...

***

Gayle wrote:
>I always wonder why we don't have people from England in the Baren. 

We'll there's _me_ ...   I don't count?

Oh, you mean living in England _now_!  Remember that most countries are
quite a long way 'behind' the US in the number of households with 'net
access.  Local calls in England (just like here in Japan) are charged
'time and distance', and 'net sessions tend to get very expensive.  (I'm
20 km from my nearest ISP, and every time I go on the net it's a long
distance call ...)

But we've been well-linked over there, and they _do_ know about
us. The rest is up to them ...

***

Julio mentioned 'holding back' his own copy of the print from his
edition ...

This will be up to Jim as the collator to decide, but I rather suspect
that it will be easier if you send your entire edition to Jim, and not
keep any back.  That way, he simply makes up a bunch of identical sets. 
If everybody keeps their own copy, he then has to keep track of which
folio belong to who - a much more troublesome task.  

It also lets him play a little game.  He will make up the pile of
identical sets, wrap them all up ready for shipping, and then will mix
them up, draw them one by one, and slap on the address labels.  Who gets
#1?  Who gets the 'last' one?  Who knows ...

Dave

------------------------------

From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 19:35:25 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1341] Re: Baren Digest V4 #237 

Somebody wrote:
>Roger, I see a charming print (though it may have what Graham sees
>as a lack of smoothness).  The texture to me is interesting, but then I
>like the German Expressionists so I'm open to that look.

I must have left the wrong impression....
The lack of smoothness is high on my preference list.  It gives the image a
feeling of life. I go for texture in all my stuff.

Regards,

Graham

------------------------------

From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Thu, 6 Aug 1998 19:43:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1342] edition #'s match set. 

Thanks for bring this to attention Julio.....
I had assumed that is how it would be done.  James was keeping track of who
was on stream when and I just assumed.....
If it wasn't planned them I am for Julio's idea.

Graham

Julio wrote....
>In an earlier posting....someone mentioned the idea....that all Baren
>members would receive the same # print on their portfolio.

------------------------------

From: Jean Eger <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Thu, 06 Aug 1998 23:51:23 -0700
Subject: [Baren 1343] Re: Baren Digest V4 #237 

Roger, I think you are being overly modest about your very attractive print.  
http://www.woodblock.com/encyclopedia/entries/016_01/016_01_frame.html

It is a nice looking print, very well-balanced with both color and shapes.
Those are great colors.  I would be very proud to own a print that looks
that good.  There's always room for improvement in whatever we do.  We make
art over and over, trying to get better.  Then one day we have done so much
art that we realize we are, in fact, artists.  We then do not make better
prints, just more prints.  But I think everyone secretly wants to get
better at their printmaking.  I hope you will join the festivities.

Dave shows great maturity and sensitivity in his ability to encourage
people to participate.  Most people would not do that.  Many people would
just shrug their shoulders and keep going.  Sometimes a little
encouragement is all that is needed.  Some people might call it a kick in
the _____.

Gayle, sorry my animation did not work for you.  YOu would have to download
nasturtium.dir to your hard drive and then rename it nasturtium.exe.  I
can't put nasturtium.exe online because when I click on it, it turns into
little letters and other code.  It's what they call a Director "projector."

I wish I could locate a woodcut artist called Jillian Gatto.  Her beautiful
work was online about three years ago.  She was called the Maine woodcut
artist.  Then her web site disappeared.  I don't know if all her low-priced
prints were sold or if they just discontinued the web site.
Sincerely,

Jean

------------------------------

End of Baren Digest V4 #238
***************************