[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest               Tuesday, 28 July 1998       Volume 04 : Number 227

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From: Gayle Wohlken <blueman@pantek.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 09:36:52 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1256] Re: Baren Digest V4 #226 

Baren,
Welcome to Ray and I can't wait to see an entry by you in the Encyclopedia.

***

Dave,
You said regarding
http://www.woodblock.com/forum/archives/vol04/extras/goyo_face.jpg

> Notice also that nearly all the delicate hair carving on the key block
> is obscured by the darker printings that come later ...

When I print with oil based ink, the keyblock comes last.  I think 
I'm getting confused about the order.  With hanga then the keyblock
is printed first, then the colors?  Is the keyblock generally printed in
a soft color?  A gray or tan?  I notice the ones with figures in them
seem to be printed in a soft hue.

By the way, thank you for that demonstration.  I like being able to see
the prints very closely like you have shown this one.

Gayle Wohlken

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From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 07:45:55 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1257] Re: Reply to welcomes/Aleutian Islands 

>One challenge I've had as a printmaker now is to figure out what to do
>with trees--the Aleutians were blessedly free of them and you could see
>the shapes of the mountains.

Two thingies here Ray.

Now, with all the wonderful forms or trees, (and you have many more in the
east) the fun part of the fun starts.
The mountains shapes just look fatter and green.  The challange will be the
greens. Tougher stuff to handle.

Have fun

Graham

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From: Matthew.W.Brown@VALLEY.NET (Matthew W Brown)
Date: 27 Jul 98 11:09:23 EDT
Subject: [Baren 1258] Paper wetting 

Jean wrote:
>I notice that when I put my dampened paper between blotters, the water 
>seems to sit on top in beads.  It is hard to get it just right for printing. 
>I am using my favorite Rives for this and smooth blotters.  I have never
>tried to use the rough blotters. Could this be the problem?

I don't think this is a sizing issue. Did you  re-stack your sheets? I use
Rives Lightwt and Heavywt a lot and find this paper dampens very well, the
method of which I will describe in a one-pointer which probably won't get sent
to Dave for another two weeks. Toshi Yoshida's book describes a method, as does
the H. Yoshida book Dave recently posted on the Pedia, without the use of
blotters, but by a pattern of re-stacking the sheets which allows the moisture
to move through the sheets.

Matt Brown

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From: StudioJNC@aol.com
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 11:48:25 EDT
Subject: [Baren 1259] Blotters and Paper 

Thanks to Dave, James and Matt, in responding to my problem re; the water
staying on top of my Rives in beads. Boy, have I been doing a bad job of
blotting my paper, both light weight and heavy Rives.  
I have been soaking the Rives for 30 minutes. Then put it between two sheets
of smooth blotters and then hand wipe the blotters, back and forth, not using
a rolling pin.  When I run my print on the damp paper I put it between two
sheets of newsprint and then two sheets of blotters, a real sandwich.
Well, I just acquired a rolling pin and will use that instead of a hit and
miss action of hand wiping.
I also weight the prints down with diving weights, perhaps too Heavy!!!!!I
I have a lot to learn and thanks for  the help.

Welcome to the new members !!

A Convention?????

Jeanne

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From: "Roger A. Ball" <beckorro@inquo.net>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 10:54:01 -0600
Subject: [Baren 1260] watercolor 

Hello all.  Welcome to the new members!

I have at last succeeded (sort of) at printing with watercolor.
It isn't much and I still have a bunch to learn, but here's a peek:

http://www.inquo.net/~beckorro/woodcut/xcard1b.jpg

Stats:
Pine, watercolor/ricepaste brushed on, single impression, Rives BFK buff
moistened overnight, barened.

Thanks to all for your help and recommendations.

Roger

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From: <DARICH@prodigy.net>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 11:35:54 -0700
Subject: [Baren 1261] Re: Possible work? 

to the printers,

I have recieved a call this morning regarding a publisher who is looking
for artwork of a Chinook Salmon to use a a book cover.  I don't happen to
have ever done a print of one myself but perhaps one of you has?

If so let me know and I'll help you connect.

Andrea

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From: Hideshi Yoshida <dodoland@silver.plala.or.jp>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 08:01:47 +0900
Subject: [Baren 1262] Re: cleaning brayers 

Dear James,

I've been busy, so I couldn't send a mail. Sorry.

You wrote
>You wrote in your answer to Graham that you print the Liquitex block
>first, and then ink on top of that.  By "ink" do you mean oil-based
>pigment?  If so, I would think you are wise to print in the order that
>you do, because-- when reversed-- the oil-based ink would repel the
>water-based Liquitex.
>
>[Liquitex is a great product, by the way.  They make the best gesso I've
>ever come across.]

Yes, I mean " ink " is oil-based ink.
I'm using lithoink produced by Japanese art material shop "Bumpodo".

Hideshi Yoshida

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From: steiner <steiner@mbox.kyoto-inet.or.jp>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 09:42:01 +0900
Subject: [Baren 1263] Welcome to Ray Hudson 

Ray; 
In your first letter, you mentioned Dale DeArmond, the Alaskan
printmaker.  Many years ago I bought a book of hers plus a set of other
books with prints done by native Canadian and Alaskan artists on their myth
themes.  I tried to contact DeArmond's publisher because I and several of
my students wanted to order more of her books. No reply.  May I ask you to
give me her address, or an address where I can contact her?  Dale's prints
are excellent;  I want her to send work to the Kyoto International
Woodprint Asso. (KIWA) exhibition next year.

Your mention of the printing technique you learned in China from Lu Fang
brought a smile to my lips. I want to comment on that for the BAREN
members.  30 years ago, when I first began to study woodblock printmaking
in Hiroshima, that was the main way westudents printed.  We used Japanese
washi which is heavier than what the paper you used seemed to be.  Printing
that way is slow, of course, but terrible accurate.  To this day, I
occasionally use that technique when I have a print that demands such
careful attention.  There are several ways to register paper on the blocks.
However, the tried and true Edo Period kento keying technique is the best,
I believe, even tho I teach some of the other methods.  Kurosaki has
evolved his own way to register the paper onto the blocks:  using a sheet
of film that has the image drawn on it, he has it attached to a stand that
sets near the "top" side of the block; that is, opposite you, the printer,
not just in front of yourself, as is the usual case.  The film is rolled up
and so rests out of the way when printing the block.  Kurosaki will bring a
block to the table (he prints standing up, as does Clifton Karhu) and lays
it down, unrolls the film over the block and peering thru the film, adjusts
the block until it lines up with that part of the image he is going to
print.  That done, the film springs back out of the way, and he inks the
block and prints it.

Toshi Yoshida used the Ukiyo-e method.  My first teacher, Tokumitsu, used
the same technique (mentioned above) as Lu Fang, and he also used another:
instead of carving the kento near the corners of the block, he would use
the actual corner of the blocks to line up the paper for printing.  Very
economical!  And last year, there was a demonstration of carving and
printing in the Chinese way by two Chinese artesians.  They were
specialists in Nenga, the New Years Good Luck prints.  The paper to be
printed, rather thin, was tightly bound on one side between two wooden
slats.  This laid on one table, the pile folded back upon itself.  This
table was separated a few centimeters from another table upon which rested
the block.  That was inked, the top sheet of paper was lifted up and laid
on the block, printed, then picked up and dropped down between the two
tables, out of the way of the next sheet.  The first color finished, the
next block was put in place, the papers lifted back up and laid down as
they had originally been, and the process repeated.  Accuracy was abysmal,
but the prints had spunk.

I could go on about moistening paper but will stop for now.
from Richard Steiner, Kyoto

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From: Elizabeth Atwood <elizuno@midcoast.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 20:46:06 -0500
Subject: [Baren 1264] New Member 

Welcome to Ray Hudson. Believe me....you will learn to do grand things with
the trees!
I'm happpy to hear that there are so many of us here in New England.

My daughter is living in the state of Washington...sometimes wishing she
were living in Vancouver.....because she fell in love with the study of
Northwest Coast Indians.....up by Prince Rupert, etc. And my nephews are in
Alaska....a beautiful part of the world......for young people.
In Northwest art,I have a handsome serigraph entitled "Sea Ghost" by Robert
Davidson. Have you collected any of his work? Also, work by Dale
DeArmand....another favorite of mine.

Thanks for the input on technique, etc.........

Bettie

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From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@islandnet.com>
Date: Mon, 27 Jul 1998 23:06:43 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Baren 1265] Re: Welcome to Ray Hudson 

 Richard Steiner, Kyoto wrote.
> I want to comment on that for the BAREN
>members.  30 years ago, when I first began to study woodblock printmaking
>in Hiroshima, that was the main way westudents printed.  We used Japanese
>washi which is heavier than what the paper you used seemed to be.  Printing
>that way is slow, of course, but terrible accurate. .................etc
>etc etc ...............
>I could go on about moistening paper but will stop for now.

Richard,     Someday it may be possible to have a little video clip showing
the verbal explanation.
I could not follow and visualize the methods and techniques you were
describing.
Is it possible you can get some digitized images to illustrate things.

Graham

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From: Jean Eger <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 00:26:58 -0700
Subject: [Baren 1266] Re: Baren Digest V4 #226 

Welcome Ray,
I was glad to read your description of your time in Hangzhou and wish you'd
write more about that.  I read about a college exchange program with a
university there, through U. Minnesota, but I couldn't pull it off.
Perhaps some other time.  Interesting that they used watercolor--was it
tube watercolor or pigment?  Is this the ancient process or one commonly
used today?  

	In San Jose, CA, I saw a print by a Vietnamese artist which was a clay
print.  It was quite beautiful but they didn't say exactly how it was done.

Graham--
	I bought an HP Photo Smart digital camera at a computer show here for $144
plus tax.  It is fun to use but the quality of the photos is VERY
disappointing.    It's very low-res, poor quality compared to a scan of a
regular photo.  I'd stick to the SLR until the technology is better, if I
were you.  On the other hand, any time I want, I can go out and take photos
without having to buy film or pay to get it developed.  Sorry Dave, that's
a bit off the subject of woodcuts.

Re: rollers.  Lacquer thinner will melt a roller.  Don't ask me how I know
that.

Jean Eger

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Jul 1998 20:51:15 +0900
Subject: [Baren 1267] Re: which came first ... 

Gayle wrote:
>When I print with oil based ink, the keyblock comes last.  I think 
>I'm getting confused about the order.  With hanga then the keyblock
>is printed first, then the colors? 

In this Japanese tradition, if I said that the keyblock was printed
first in about 99.99% of cases, I think I might be underestimating it.

The keyblock is the root and foundation of these prints.  It is carved
first, and acts as the origin for the colour blocks, and it is then
printed first, and acts as the framework for the colours.  

As to the colour of the keyblock, in the Ukiyo-e tradition it is most
frequently printed in a muted grey, although a number of Hokusai's
landscapes use Prussian Blue.

And in answer to the next obvious question - If the key block is printed
first, don't the colours cover up the outlines? - the answer is that
with one exception (the white pigment known as 'gofun') the pigments
used are transparent.  The keyblock lines show clearly through the
overlaid colours.

It is the opaqueness of gofun that leads to it only being used for
applying highlights on top of other colours, and for such things as snow
that is sometimes 'sprayed' on top of prints.  It is never used to mix
other colours into more delicate tints, as it turns them into a chalky
white and semi-opaque colour which is unacceptable in this tradition. 
Red is red.  To make pink, one simply adds water ... never white.

***

While I'm talking about Gayle ... I should mention that her contribution
to the 'Who is Baren' page went up this afternoon, including a few
prints you haven't seen before.  While I was at it, I also did the page
for recent new member Elizabeth Atwood, containing three of her prints
(Bettie, after people have had a chance to see these, I hope you will
consider making a post giving us some information on how they were 
made ...).  

So 11 of the 45 [Baren] members are now represented on that page, and a
couple more are in preparation ...  I'd like it to be 45 out of 45!

http://www.woodblock.com/forum/ 

***

I'd also like to ask about some of your addresses ...  I sent my newest
newsletter out to the printer this afternoon, and it will be ready to
mail shortly.  Anybody who isn't yet on my personal mailing list and who
would like to receive these things, please let me know your address (off
list ...).  (If you got the previous one OK, then you're
already on the list ...)

Dave

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End of Baren Digest V4 #227
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