[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest                Saturday, 9 May 1998        Volume 03 : Number 150

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From: Ray Esposito <brassring@brassring.org>
Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 10:23:04 -0400
Subject: [Baren 719] editions and other 

Hi Folks,
I sent Dave better photos of three of my four prints for the Newbie Journal
which he has graciously taken the time to repost.  They look a lot more
like they should.  I also learned something about showing prints on the
net.  When I mentioned to Dave how bad the prints looked (forgetting the
original photos weren't all that good to begin with) he told me my computer
might have something to do with it.

Our local library provides internet access to the public so while there on
another matter I deceided to check out Baren on their system.  WOW...even
the original pictures looked good.  I am anxious to get over their to see
what the new ones look like.  The coloring on my computer looksall wrong.

This preamble leads me to suggest a new thread.  

There is more and more art going up on the web.  All of us want our works
to look as good as possible.  How about those of you with experience in
this area beginning a thread about the best way to post pix on the web.

I can begin by saying how important it is to have good pictures to begin
with.  As a result of the lousy first set of photos I sent Dave, I have set
up a new area in my house with all of the proper lighting and equipment to
take good photos.  This will be needed anyway to take slides and pix for
other purposes.

EDITIONS

I have been re-reading the excellent discussion in the early days on Baren
concerning editions.  I do not want to rehash that discussion but need some
advice.

Since a monotypist is not concerned with editions, it is a problem I have
not faced.  In thinking about the original discussion, I looked at Dave's
points and although in my heart I agree with him, I also accept Graham's
many excellent comments.  I live in the US and that is where my art will be
sold if it sells at all.  I belong to three printmaking groups and everyone
in these groups editions their works.  I see no benefit going against the
flow.  I am a renegade by nature but not stupid.

I have a question concerning what is an edition.  Permit me to ask it with
a fictional example.  If I do a wood block and print 10 on Hosho and 10 on
Rives BFK, do I have an edition of 20 or two editions of 10?  If I add
something to the block later by additional cutting, a second state as it
were, and printed 10 more, do I have a new edition?  Would I in fact be
honest by pulling 10 more or should the blocks have been destroyed and a
totally new block cut including recutting the original design with the
additions I want?

The above is not so far off from what I did with my first blocks.  If you
read the Newbie Journal you know I started printing on Hosho but switched
to Rives BFK.  Should I toss out the Hosho prints and reprint everything on
BFK so that both prints are on the same paper?

After reviewing the prints, I am not happy.  They seem incomplete.  I want
to add additional cutting to the blocks.  I may even cut a third block and
add it to the existing prints.  I can certainly do this if no prints have
been sold.  But what if one was sold?  Doesn't that preclude making changes
or can I do so by making the changes a second state?  

As I said, I do not want to rehash the editions debate.  Just thinking out
loud about my particular situation.  

Any thoughts that might benefit everyone would be appreciated.

Cheers

Ray Esposito

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From: Gary Luedtke <GLuedtke@compuserve.com>
Date: Fri, 8 May 1998 17:42:50 -0400
Subject: [Baren 720] editions and other 

Ray,

I'll chime in here because this is not a cutting or printing question.  In
my opinion, drop the editioning and you cease to have a problem.  Don't
number them.  Each will simply stand on its own.  If you change it, or your
technique, or the paper, or colors, or whatever,  you have not misled
anyone.  Later, after you have created a larger audience,  and you are more
sure of yourself and techniques, you can always set up an edition.  You'll
have enough experience to have settled on what you want and not have to
experiment around.  Do your experimenting first, when you settle on the
print, edition it then if you like.

I have collected prints and not one has an edition number on it.  Maybe
that's because I like Japanese prints and it wasn't common practice at the
time these prints were made.  It makes no difference to me, and actually I
prefer that they do not.  That starts the collector down a different road
of thought, away from the art itself, and into the realm of value.   When
someone buys one of my prints, I hope they intend to appreciate it over a
long time, not begin speculating already on what it might be sold for in
the future.  I have never "collected" a print because of it's scarcity, nor
declined buying one because it was commonly available.  If I like it for
its own artistic and technical qualities, and I can afford it, that is
enough for me.   Hopefully that will be enough for your collectors.

I do need to mention that my own prints are editioned and admit my
hypocracy up front.  I did it too at the urging of galleries, because they
seem to sell better to American audiences.  My prints were also carved and
printed by someone else far away, so an "edition" was a reasonable
direction to go as I could not easily schedule this person to print me off
a few here and a few more a month later.  It was a one shot deal once the
proof was approved, and the batch was baked.   That's the slant from this
angle.

Gary

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 07:31:54 +0900
Subject: [Baren 721] Re: editions ... 

Ray wrote:
> I have a question concerning what is an edition.  ....
> If I add something to the block later by additional cutting, a second state as it
> were, and printed 10 more, do I have a new edition?  Would I in fact be
> honest by pulling 10 more or should the blocks have been destroyed and a
> totally new block cut including recutting the original design with the
> additions I want?

I'm the wrong guy to discuss this Ray, but it seems to me that you're
perhaps missing one of the main points here ...  The concept of 'what is
an edition' is supposed to come from _you_ the creator of the work. 
Before you start running the 'edition' you are to think ... test ...
proof ... think some more ... proof some more, etc .... and then when
things have 'come together' in your mind, and _only_ then, you should
proceed with making the print you want to see.  Make the quantity you
wish, sign them, etc. and _that_ becomes the edition.   

When you said that:
> After reviewing the prints, I am not happy ...
I think most of us would want to tell you the same thing - cut them in
half, toss them, and start again.  If they've already been sent out into
the world, then just shrug your shoulders, get out a new piece of wood,
and start on your next print, determining to improve.

My point is that the experimentation takes place at the proofing stage,
not at the editioning stage.  And proofing isn't something that can be
easily done in one afternoon.  Make some samples, stick 'em up on your
wall with some thumbtacks, and see how they look as the days go by.  If
my own experience is anything to go by, you will _very soon_ start to
notice many ways in which they can be improved. 

And I don't think I'm alone in saying that ...

Dave B.

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From: Ray Esposito <brassring@brassring.org>
Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 19:41:39 -0400
Subject: [Baren 722] Re: editions and other 

Gary,

Thank you for your thoughts.  All advice is appreciated and will be put
into my thought processes as I decide where I want to take all this.

Cheers

Ray,

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From: Ray Esposito <brassring@brassring.org>
Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 19:46:08 -0400
Subject: [Baren 723] Re: editions ... 

Dave

Thank you for the advice.  As I said to Gary, it is deeply appreciated.
These are all things that newbies need to know.  You suggested some things
I am already doing and am glad to know I am heading in the right direction.
 I will put into practice many of your ideas.

Cheers

Ray

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From: Jean Eger <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Fri, 08 May 1998 17:11:04 -0700
Subject: [Baren 724] Re: copyright 

Dear Baren People,
With 10 years of small newspaper publishing experience and a course in libel law at 
U,.C. Berkeley  behind me, I suggest you get the writer's or artist's permission 
before you publish anything current or with a copyright on it.  That means
permission that isn't under pressure.  Some people want their work to be published, 
even without pay.  Other people guard their intellectual property rights  and their 
privacy closely.
Sincerely,
Jean Eger

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Sat, 09 May 1998 21:08:04 +0900
Subject: [Baren 725] One-point lesson ... 

Here is this week's 'One-point' lesson, contributed by Matt Brown

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(#4)  Matt Brown's Recipe for Rice Paste:

It took me months of trial and error to work out for myself a workable paste
recipe. I had Toshi Yoshida's directions from 'Japanese Print-making' to go on.
He had me letting my rice soak several days, grinding my rice in a mortar and
pestle, straining it with cheesecloth . . . it wasn't long before I realized if
I was going to make this print-making work for me I would have to simplify this
paste part, and find my own way. The following recipe is one which works 
better for me than anything I had been able to make using Mr. Yoshida's approach 
(it seemed to make a great difference, for instance, what kind of rice I used). It
differs significantly from Walter Phillips' approach in that Phillips brought
his paste to a boil, something Yoshida advised against, pointing out that if
boiled after time it will go runny (something I have found to be true).

Start with bookmaker's rice starch (made by Lineco), available from Kremer
Pigments (www.kremer-pigmente.de/).  Note: though their web-site is fascinating,
full of stories of Dr. Kremer finding rare pigments, etc. I couldn't find the
rice starch listed. Call 800-995-5501 for their catalogue.

Using a heavy saucepan, mix a proportion of approximately 1:8 rice starch to 
water. I generally do batches of 1 tbspn starch to 2/3 cup water.

Stir continuously over a low heat, until mixture begins to thicken and turn
somewhat translucent. Remove from heat (this is just a little bit before it
begins to boil), keep stirring as it cools (set pan in cold water to hasten
cooling). 

It takes about five minutes to make a batch. It actually does take practice to
get a feel for exactly when to remove it from the heat. Kept in the refrigerator
paste will remain good about three days, but I generally make a fresh batch
each day.

(contributed by Matt Brown)

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Next week,  Seki-san has a close shave ...

These 'One-point' lessons are being collected into a section in the
[Baren] Encyclopedia of Woodblock Printmaking.
http://www.woodblock.com/encyclopedia/updates.html

Contributions from experienced printmakers for future 'One-pointers' 
are eagerly solicited.

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End of Baren Digest V3 #150
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